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  #1  
Old 30-09-2016, 07:56 AM
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Default Buying GU with TD4.2 and LPG fitted: wise choice??

Hi All. But new here and keen on a GU TD4.2. I've seen two fitted with LPG kits. Owners say the increase in power is great but I'm thinking, at what cost? Will running LPG find any weaknesses in the trusty 4.2 (bearings and bushes maybe?). Thanks for input. Cheers.


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Old 30-09-2016, 09:09 AM
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Had mine installed 8 years ago, fabulous for towing. You won't feel a great surge in power, but it's there when you need it, it's like a 6th gear and makes overtaking a breeze even with 3.2t behind.

There were 2 systems when I got mine which is 'Diesel Gas Technologies' and the other is 'Diesel Gas Australia'. The tank is supposed to be replaced after 10 years so worth checking on installation date as you may be up for that expense. I've done about 150,000km since installed. Bear in mind you don't necessarily leave it on all the time, I usually have it switched off whilst driving around town and remember you are ALWAYS using diesel, it's NOT like a petrol system.

I have only had one on going problem to do with LPG gauge which has fits of on/off. Just sent gauge back to manufacturer last week after exhausting all possibilities of earth fault, but no problem found with Apexus gauge. It may run ok for several days then just decide to blackout and not come back on for several minutes /hours. I have a feeling it's heat related and maybe an overheating wire somewhere. Anyone else experienced same ?
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Old 30-09-2016, 01:50 PM
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I had the Diesel Gas Australia (Lovato Auto Gas) system on my ZD30 and I do not think it was a good idea for the motor or a good system as it gave me a lot of troubles. But that was on a ZD30 which are more known for having head crack issues and I don't think the gas helped particularly when the regulator leaked for the second or third time and lost coolant causing a possible over heat in the head.

On a TD42 these are a lot different motor, cast iron head does not suffer the same problems.
Advice would be check the install date and see if it is going to be due for a replacement of the gas tank or regulator. Check there are no coolant leaks around the regulator. Remember as Porks said, you do not have to use it all the time.

Porks,
yes my switch/gauge played up and had a replacement under warranty and that has been fine since.

Is yours the small round Apexus model PG200-a-1 with LED lights for the tank fill level, I have a spare if you want.
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Old 30-09-2016, 05:29 PM
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Thanks for the offer Geordie, yes it is the PG200 but Apexus has just assured me that it's not the gauge, they even sent me back another wiring loom foc. I'll keep your offer in mind, thank you.

Last week, 3 days in succession the gauge worked for the first 20mins then blacked out. It came back on after 30mins on one day only. Every morning on a cold motor it came on. But in the past there have been occasions when it hasn't come on when cold. There is no real pattern to it except I do feel it is heat related. Have learnt to live with it and never blamed the gauge up until now when I finally decided to have it tested.

On long drives across the Nullarbor or up the Stuart Hwy it might stay on for hours, black out for 10/20/30/50 mins, stop for lunch and it might resume. Have filed every earth point I can find, yes I have chassis earth strap and additional earth on gas computer box.

It's a mystery I wish I could solve.
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Old 30-09-2016, 06:01 PM
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Thanks All. One of the sellers states a 20% power gain. That's akin to another turbo!! All in all sounds like a reliable and useful proposition. I'm surprised it's not more popular...or is it?


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Old 30-09-2016, 07:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steelejez View Post
Thanks All. One of the sellers states a 20% power gain. That's akin to another turbo!! All in all sounds like a reliable and useful proposition. I'm surprised it's not more popular...or is it?


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Plenty of info on this forum about it mate, so do some digging for the facts. I had intended to use LPG on my TD42, but now I know more about it I would never use it.
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Old 30-09-2016, 08:46 PM
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Yeah, digging around as I type. Interesting and I am getting your point. Cheers.


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Old 30-09-2016, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steelejez View Post
Thanks All. One of the sellers states a 20% power gain. That's akin to another turbo!! All in all sounds like a reliable and useful proposition. I'm surprised it's not more popular...or is it?


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Ive had a diesel gas aust system on my zd30 for a long time now. Its great for towing and just the extra kick around town.
Had no problems with it, service is cheap and friendly near the city where they check everything and can retune.

Dunno about the 4.2 but ive had no problems with mine.

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Old 06-10-2016, 04:52 PM
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I have a TD42 with gas. It came with the car when I bought it. I generally leave it on all the time but it uses hardly any gas around town because the injection unit only operates when boost is above about 3psi. It provides a bit more power but most passengers can't tell the difference when it is on and off. I use about 1 litre of gas for every 10 litres of diesel on the highway so cost of fuel savings are not great. The EGT goes up a little at full throttle with the gas but I'd say that is because my mixture is very lean (22:1) without it because my pump is maxed out. I have had no problems with the engine due to the gas installation but I've had the gas injector fail and have to be replaced. It is a PITA to fill at most servos because it is rare to get a diesel pump beside an LPG pump so you need to move lanes to fill with both fuels.

If I did not have one I would not bother getting one fitted. With most installs you lose the aux fuel tank and get a 25 litre gas tank in its place. Last I heard, install price was about $5k with a $1.7k gov rebate to take off that. For that sort of money you can get a better turbo system & intercooler that will produce more power than the gas injection system with none of the disadvantages.
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Old 06-10-2016, 05:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Overboard View Post
I have a TD42 with gas. It came with the car when I bought it. I generally leave it on all the time but it uses hardly any gas around town because the injection unit only operates when boost is above about 3psi. It provides a bit more power but most passengers can't tell the difference when it is on and off. I use about 1 litre of gas for every 10 litres of diesel on the highway so cost of fuel savings are not great. The EGT goes up a little at full throttle with the gas but I'd say that is because my mixture is very lean (22:1) without it because my pump is maxed out. I have had no problems with the engine due to the gas installation but I've had the gas injector fail and have to be replaced. It is a PITA to fill at most servos because it is rare to get a diesel pump beside an LPG pump so you need to move lanes to fill with both fuels.

If I did not have one I would not bother getting one fitted. With most installs you lose the aux fuel tank and get a 25 litre gas tank in its place. Last I heard, install price was about $5k with a $1.7k gov rebate to take off that. For that sort of money you can get a better turbo system & intercooler that will produce more power than the gas injection system with none of the disadvantages.


That's bloody great advice and duly noted. Thank you!


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Old 06-10-2016, 05:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Overboard View Post
I have a TD42 with gas. It came with the car when I bought it. I generally leave it on all the time but it uses hardly any gas around town because the injection unit only operates when boost is above about 3psi. It provides a bit more power but most passengers can't tell the difference when it is on and off. I use about 1 litre of gas for every 10 litres of diesel on the highway so cost of fuel savings are not great. The EGT goes up a little at full throttle with the gas but I'd say that is because my mixture is very lean (22:1) without it because my pump is maxed out. I have had no problems with the engine due to the gas installation but I've had the gas injector fail and have to be replaced. It is a PITA to fill at most servos because it is rare to get a diesel pump beside an LPG pump so you need to move lanes to fill with both fuels.

If I did not have one I would not bother getting one fitted. With most installs you lose the aux fuel tank and get a 25 litre gas tank in its place. Last I heard, install price was about $5k with a $1.7k gov rebate to take off that. For that sort of money you can get a better turbo system & intercooler that will produce more power than the gas injection system with none of the disadvantages.
Do 4.2s have the same fuel tank set up as zd30s?

I still have my main and sub and a 25L gas tank which is fitted under the car with a gaurd. Only change under there is i dont have a rear muffler. In fact i have no mufflers on my beaudesrt exhaust so it didnt really matter.

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Old 06-10-2016, 06:52 PM
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Do 4.2s have the same fuel tank set up as zd30s?

I still have my main and sub and a 25L gas tank which is fitted under the car with a gaurd. Only change under there is i dont have a rear muffler. In fact i have no mufflers on my beaudesrt exhaust so it didnt really matter.
Yeah the muffler is the issue.

I've enquired about this because even though I have a long range main tank I'd like the extra capacity of the aux tank but my local auto gas fitter says it is not legal because a proper muffler can't be run when the aux tank is retained. Those that keep the aux tank remove the box muffler and either fit a straight through pipe with no muffler at all or fit skinny hot dogs that don't meet the roadworthy spec for noise. They then mount the gas tank where the muffler was instead of in the aux tank position. Apparently someone got pinged for it in Cairns years ago only a few weeks after he had the conversion done and the gas fitter that did the conversion had to refit a new muffler, remove the aux tank and refit the gas tank in its place and then cough up for a Long Ranger main tank to maintain the original fuel capacity that was promised in the quote. Word is that it cost him something like $3k all up to make the install comply with all aspects of the law.
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Old 06-10-2016, 08:30 PM
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Yeah the muffler is the issue.

I've enquired about this because even though I have a long range main tank I'd like the extra capacity of the aux tank but my local auto gas fitter says it is not legal because a proper muffler can't be run when the aux tank is retained. Those that keep the aux tank remove the box muffler and either fit a straight through pipe with no muffler at all or fit skinny hot dogs that don't meet the roadworthy spec for noise. They then mount the gas tank where the muffler was instead of in the aux tank position. Apparently someone got pinged for it in Cairns years ago only a few weeks after he had the conversion done and the gas fitter that did the conversion had to refit a new muffler, remove the aux tank and refit the gas tank in its place and then cough up for a Long Ranger main tank to maintain the original fuel capacity that was promised in the quote. Word is that it cost him something like $3k all up to make the install comply with all aspects of the law.
On my car the main and sub tank are on the drivers side and rear of the car. I recall i have some expensive spiral muffler thing (vortex?) In the last segment. Id love a long range tank!

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Old 08-10-2016, 10:43 AM
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On my car the main and sub tank are on the drivers side and rear of the car. I recall i have some expensive spiral muffler thing (vortex?) In the last segment. Id love a long range tank!
TDs have the same tank layout as ZDs.

I wonder if the Vortex unit makes it comply with the ADR standard for noise. I know there are lots of guys running straight through pipes but I've read of a few getting caught.

Long range tanks are expensive and you have to be careful with them because you occasionally drag them on the ground. Mine is full of scratches and dents but no leaks so far. A lift of at least 2" is essential. Talking to one of the staff at Birdsville they said that a common reason for them to do recoveries from the Simmo is for vehicles that have split long range tanks by repeatedly thumping them on the hump between the wheel tracks. Heavily laden vehicles with overheated shocks combined with the high hump sand forms between the wheel tracks is not a good recipe. I was very conscious of it but still kissed the ground with it dozens of times. Fortunately sand makes a pretty soft surface to hit. Long range tanks are nice to have but are not without their disadvantages.
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Old 08-10-2016, 11:28 AM
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I put a gas system on my 6.5 Chev turbo a few years back. At the time there was a federal and state government rebate. Total cost was only $700! For that money it was worth a shot.
After initial problems with it (faulty injector nozzle) it ran sweet for years. I had it dynoed and power increase was exactly 20% with the gas on. Fuel savings were negligible. I left the gas on all the time. You didn't notice the extra power when it was on but you certainly noticed it when it was off.
I had the gas tank put on the passenger side chassis rail as I didn't want to lose a fuel tank. Muffler was replaced with a hotdog and also a resonator toward the tail pipe. No noisy exhaust issue. Actually I ended up removing the resonator for a better exhaust note.
The most annoying thing was filling the tank.
Would I do it again now without the rebates - no way. Cost does not outweigh the benefits. I would spend the money on intercooler/turbo/airbox/snorkel upgrades instead.
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Old 08-10-2016, 04:12 PM
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I had the gas tank put on the passenger side chassis rail as I didn't want to lose a fuel tank.
Where did you have the gas filler?
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Old 08-10-2016, 04:22 PM
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Here are some pics of my filler, tank, and muffler











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Old 08-10-2016, 04:26 PM
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I wonder if the Vortex unit makes it comply with the ADR standard for noise. I know there are lots of guys running straight through pipes but I've read of a few getting caught.
You are probably onto something there as beadesert insisted i had either a rear muffler or a vortex. The vortex wasnt cheap, but i guess it was worth it. My car sounds quieter than a zd30 with a 3" exhaust, and i get a nice beeooowww sound when i back off.



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Old 08-10-2016, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
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Here are some pics of my filler, tank, and muffler
Thanks. My gas filler is where the aux tank filler is.

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You are probably onto something there as beadesert insisted i had either a rear muffler or a vortex.
The bloke that I heard got done by Qld Transport had some sort of muffler but for some reason was required to present it to the transport department for an inspection where it failed the noise test. The result was that all the gas fitters in this area no longer fit the gas tank in place of the muffler. That way if the car fails a noise test it is not their problem. I'm wondering if TD42s are different to ZD30s in this regard.
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Old 08-10-2016, 05:35 PM
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Thanks. My gas filler is where the aux tank filler is.



The bloke that I heard got done by Qld Transport had some sort of muffler but for some reason was required to present it to the transport department for an inspection where it failed the noise test. The result was that all the gas fitters in this area no longer fit the gas tank in place of the muffler. That way if the car fails a noise test it is not their problem. I'm wondering if TD42s are different to ZD30s in this regard.
Td4.2s would be noisier anyway wouldnt they and have more noise to muffle? There is a guy that lives around the corner who has a gu 4.2 and i can hear him every time he goes around the corner.. sounds like a tank.

I do have an outlaw 200cc high flow cat too which probably helps.

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