Laminova water to air intercooler

[Matt.McInnes]

Originally Posted by mickyd555

never mind, i got the answer elsewhere. I didnt realise there was more than one thread on this topic

[mickyd555]

Originally Posted by Matt.McInnes

sorry matt

[Matt.McInnes]

Originally Posted by mickyd555

sorry matt

Did I miss something, I did not even see a question.

[Matt.McInnes]

Well final testing is done, the Mav fiished.

Dyno'd today at 35C ambient

No dyno print outs Andy @ Dzltec is not back until tomorrow so some time next week.

Twin thermos gave us the extra cooling on the dyno adding 4.5kw

So all up now 104.5kw @12 PSI ambient 35C

26% power increase from what we started with and cooler EGT's

[Matt.McInnes]

Final run on the dyno.



Also the missing pre and post Map graph.

[thepaperboy]

Originally Posted by Matt.McInnes

I hate to imagine the cost of extras for this one and it will be VERY bling. Twin turbo LS1

The twin turbo LS1 isn't in a Supra by any chance is it ?

[Matt.McInnes]

No a 1952 Ford Mercury

[MQ SWB#14]

hey guys i have seen what your up too and sounds sweet i am putting some thought into how I'm going to do mine with the Laminova technology and what i wouldn't mind knowing is

how much does the inter cooler rad block the engine rads air flow?
and is that the most HP you can get out of the system?

thanks fellas keep up the engineering

[Matt.McInnes]

Originally Posted by MQ SWB#14

hey guys i have seen what your up too and sounds sweet i am putting some thought into how I'm going to do mine with the Laminova technology and what i wouldn't mind knowing is

how much does the inter cooler rad block the engine rads air flow?
and is that the most HP you can get out of the system?

thanks fellas keep up the engineering

Up to 600 HP but keep in mind HP and cooling ability are 2 different things.

[MQ SWB#14]

what do you mean by HP and cooling are 2 different things

what HP u getting from yours?

[Matt.McInnes]

Originally Posted by MQ SWB#14

what do you mean by HP and cooling are 2 different things

what HP u getting from yours?

Example:

A 1Ltr Engine running 30psi making will make x amount of HP, lets say for arguments sake 400hp
A 2Ltr Enigine running 15psi as above lets say for arguments sake will make 400hp.

The 1Ltr engine requires twice the boost of the 2Ltr engine to make the same HP. Generating 30 psi will heat the air twice as much as generating 15psi. So pre inter cooler temps are dependent on boost not HP.

Hope that makes sense, more psi more heat.

I make around 240hp @ the rear wheels, Marin around 140hp, but Marin's Diesel runs 12psi and makes 115C pre intercooler where as min runs 9psi and makes 82C at the same point. So as you can see HP and required cooling are very different things.

[bennoGU28]

Also why marine engines can make so much more horsepower out of the same cubic capacity with dependable reliability because cooling is so much easier.

Navistar PowerStroke 7.3l in marine form, dependant on application, makes 330hp

Navistar PowerStroke 7.3l, in F truck application, makes 215 hp

If you could double or triple the F-Truck cooling ability you should be able to get 330hp marine tuned engines fitted, but its all money and time.

[Matt.McInnes]

Originally Posted by bennoGU28

Also why marine engines can make so much more horsepower out of the same cubic capacity with dependable reliability because cooling is so much easier.

Navistar PowerStroke 7.3l in marine form, dependant on application, makes 330hp

Navistar PowerStroke 7.3l, in F truck application, makes 215 hp

If you could double or triple the F-Truck cooling ability you should be able to get 330hp marine tuned engines fitted, but its all money and time.

Plenty of cold cold water on tap.

[bennoGU28]

Originally Posted by Matt.McInnes

Plenty of cold cold water on tap.

[MQ SWB#14]

Originally Posted by Matt.McInnes

Example:

A 1Ltr Engine running 30psi making will make x amount of HP, lets say for arguments sake 400hp
A 2Ltr Enigine running 15psi as above lets say for arguments sake will make 400hp.

The 1Ltr engine requires twice the boost of the 2Ltr engine to make the same HP. Generating 30 psi will heat the air twice as much as generating 15psi. So pre inter cooler temps are dependent on boost not HP.

Hope that makes sense, more psi more heat.

I make around 240hp @ the rear wheels, Marin around 140hp, but Marin's Diesel runs 12psi and makes 115C pre intercooler where as min runs 9psi and makes 82C at the same point. So as you can see HP and required cooling are very different things.

okay i think i get it if i put lets say 10psi in and the cooler i make the charge air the mor HP?

and is that why marin makes 140 due to hotter precooler temps and you make 240HP due to cooler pre cooler temps?

so what about after Inter cooler temps wouldnt marins make more due to higher efficiency cooler

how does his compare to your? have you guys got similar setups?

thanks

[marin]

Can't compare our cars in the slightest, Matt's engine is a fuel injected, custom built, fully worked with aftermarket computer and large turbo PETROL engine based on a 2F, mine is a stock as a rock TD42 with a bolt on DTS turbo kit and no fuel pump or injector mods.

They behave quite differently when reacting to boost.

marin

[marin]

Originally Posted by MQ SWB#14

okay i think i get it if i put lets say 10psi in and the cooler i make the charge air the mor HP?

and is that why marin makes 140 due to hotter precooler temps and you make 240HP due to cooler pre cooler temps?

so what about after Inter cooler temps wouldnt marins make more due to higher efficiency cooler

how does his compare to your? have you guys got similar setups?

thanks

Sorry, let me answer your actual questions.

Cooling the charge air means that the air becomes more dense, meaning more oxygen that can be burnt for the same volume of air. You need to add more fuel to get more power after doing this.

The power thing... that is completely to do with the engine. Matt's is petrol and custom built, big garrett ball bearing turbo, mine is stock TD42 with small mitsubishi bush turbo.

Matt's has a larger volume of water due to piping and larger radiator. I'm not sure what you mean about mine being "higher efficiency cooler".

My radiator is at the front, Matt's is rear mounted.

If you are really interested, and have a spare 2 hours or so, read here for his truck build up, and here for his original intercooler build up, will explain a lot about the coolers.

marin

[MQ SWB#14]

Marin i thought you were making the laminova intercooler for more efficiency(better cooling)and more pwr

[Matt.McInnes]

Originally Posted by MQ SWB#14

Marin i thought you were making the laminova intercooler for more efficiency(better cooling)and more pwr

No me and Awill4x4 are making them Marin was just a guinea pig and we are making them for better cooling, therefor more power and better efficiency are the end result.

Marin is correct though you can not compare our 4x4's in any way at all. You can however compare the intercoolers to some degree but they are not identical. Both cool exceptionally well with little or no heat rise from been off boost to full boost, also both have incredibly low pressure drops and no pressure spikes.

[Matt.McInnes]

Well Dzltec's 8 core is almost complete, this has to cope with up to 50PSI of boost from the compound turbo's.









One of the kit's like Marin's ready to go out Tuesday. End caps to suit hose tails.



The first of the bolt on inter-cooler's is ready for fabrication with 4 more ready and waiting once we have finalized the design of the outer skin. Just to show how small the second generation end plates are. Standard size business card.