All your 2013 Y61 3 inch lift Questions Answered - Patrol 4x4 - Nissan Patrol Forum
Patrol 4x4 - Nissan Patrol Forum, Photos, Directory

 


Go Back   Patrol 4x4 - Nissan Patrol Forum > General Technical Discussions > Suspension

Patrol4x4.com is the premier Nissan Patrol Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 31-05-2013, 04:51 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 27
Thanks: 3
Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts
Default All your 2013 Y61 3 inch lift Questions Answered

Hi all I have just recently completed a 3 inch lift on a 2013 Y61 Nissan Patrol and thought I would give you all my experience from the perspective of a consumer i.e. I did not undertake the work myself, not because I have no mechanical aptitude but because of lack of time and facilities.
The other thing I found was that there were a number of questions I needed answers to which no one was able to answer.
I will go through the questions I had and provide you the answers as I now have them based on my experience.
I will note that I bought this 4 x 4 brand new and after the lift still wanted the vehicle to drive and feel like a brand new 4 x 4 so my desired outcome was an improved on road vehicle with exceptional off road capabilities.

1) Q: What parts do I NEED to buy? A: Springs, Shocks, Rear brake lines, Brake Bias Bracket, Sway bar link pin extensions Castor kit, Drag ling, Steering Damper and Adjustable Upper Rear Control Arms. You also need a wheel alignment after the lift and to bleed the brakes after installing the brake lines. (get braided ones)

To further explain this parts list I went with EFS springs and shocks, the rear brake lines are required for the lift and you use the rear lines on the front, The brake bracket has meant that the computer controlled traction systems have not been affected, the castor correction bushes correct the steering angle (stop the vehicle feeling like it's floating all over the road) the sway bar link pin extensions are needed to stop body roll while on road, I installed the drag link because after the lift my steering wheel was off centre by 1/4 of a turn, I installed the adjustable upper rear control arms because I had rear driveshaft noise after the lift.

2) Q: Will installing a lift in the 2013 Y61 patrol affect the VDC that’s Vehicle Dynamic Control? A: No I have done 20 hours of off road thus far on gravel roads as well as more extreem trails and have had no issues.

3) Q: I have been told you get "complications" when you go over a 50mm lift, what the hell does that mean? A: This is the second time I have lifted a vehicle over 50mm, and both times I got driveshaft noise, the answer with the 2013 Y61 patrol is to install adjustable upper rear control arms to correct the driveshaft angle at both the rear diff and transfer case by matching the angel they connect at each end to be the same. The second thing you need to do which you don't need to do with a 50mm lift is install an adjustable drag link to return the steering wheel to centre.

4) Q: What size tyres can or should I install? A: I went from the standard tyres to a 33 inch Summit Mud Hog tyre 285mm in width, if you want to go wider in the tyre you will need to install adjustable pan hard rods. The wheels are slightly offset at the moment but it is not able to be seen with 285mm wide tyres. The 33 inch tyres did scrub on the mud guards at the front, I bent the existing mounts back slightly and they now do not scrub. The other thing to note is how much your speedo will be out with the 33inch tyres the answer is not much, when assessed against my GPS if you keep the needle on the 100k mark you are doing 102ks, in standard form the Nissan Patrol reads 100ks when you are actually doing 97ks.

5) Q: Spring rates? A: Don't fall into the trap of going to stiff, you need to realistically assess what you are doing as well as your accessories, I went for Heavy duty in the front as I have a steel bull bar and winch installed and I went for the medium in the back (350kg of constant load) simply because my vehicle is used for recreational use only and we don't travel light, we don't tow but I have 3 kids and like to carry plenty of water and gear.

6) So how does it handle? A: I went for the EFS short travel kit which means this is a traditional 3inch lift many people are going for a long travel kit where a 5 inch shock is used with a 75mm spring either a long travel spring (suspension stuff) or a spring guide and dislodging spring can be used. Both long travel kits (from what I have been told) can have some noise so this is why I did not select either.
For my needs this kit handles GREAT off road, gravel roads are smooth, like driving on a cloud, when you hit big bumps the kit handles it perfectly. On the more extreme trails this kit articulates like you would not believe, I had a 80 series Landcruiser with a 4 inch lift and it did not articulate anywhere near as well as this 3 inch lift on the patrol. I went 4 x 4 with a Pajero which had a 50mm lift on the weekend, on a rutted out section of trail he lifted a wheel approximately 500mm and my wheels remained on the ground.

7) Q: Yea all that off road ability sounds great but what's it really like on road where I do most of my driving, is my wife going to kill me when she takes the kids to school in this thing. A: There is definitely more body roll, in my case this is also attributed to the 33 inch mud tyres. If you don't install an adjustable drag link and adjustable rear control arms your wife WILL kill you. I believe you could take some more body roll out by installing drop boxes. I will not be doing that as my castor correction bushes, in my opinion, are working fine.

In conclusion

I hope some of this helps and answers some questions if you are thinking of lifting your brand new Nissan Patrol 3 inches. I must say for me this has been well worth the trouble as now I can go and enjoy the many 4 x 4 parks and tracks near me with other vehicles without worrying about body damage, the only problem is once you get off road you never want to come home.

Last edited by mad001; 31-05-2013 at 08:20 PM. Reason: Spelling and grammar Oldmate made me feel guilty.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to mad001 For This Useful Post:
bobryaner (23-12-2013), jimbodeluxe (20-03-2016), Overboard (28-09-2014)
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old 31-05-2013, 05:24 PM
Oldmate's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 391
Thanks: 9
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Default

It's brake not break!

Nice write up though
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 31-05-2013, 05:46 PM
River rat's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Central Victoria
Posts: 789
Thanks: 11
Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts
Garage
Default

I have the 2.5 inch flexi coils with 30mm spacers and 5 inch shocks and with 2 deg caster bushes it still wonders at higher speeds! So i have ordered a set of buds customs drop boxes to see how they go. I am told these are the lowest profile drop box on the market and only made for 3-4" lifts. By the way, the flexi coils and monotube shocks ride really nice! Crap all over my OME 2" kit for road comfort.
__________________
2013 ST Plus Special Edition

CRD Club #104
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 31-05-2013, 05:50 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 27
Thanks: 3
Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts
Default

****

Last edited by mad001; 31-05-2013 at 08:22 PM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 31-05-2013, 05:56 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 27
Thanks: 3
Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by River rat View Post
I have the 2.5 inch flexi coils with 30mm spacers and 5 inch shocks and with 2 deg caster bushes it still wonders at higher speeds! So i have ordered a set of buds customs drop boxes to see how they go. I am told these are the lowest profile drop box on the market and only made for 3-4" lifts. By the way, the flexi coils and monotube shocks ride really nice! Crap all over my OME 2" kit for road comfort.

Do the springs make any noise off road?

I have found mine wanders a little more than when it was standard but is not at all excessive. I would expect that yours would be more supple at the top of the stroke i.e. handles small corrigations very well, but tends to wander on road due to the very progressive nature of the spring rate. Is this a fair assumption?
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 31-05-2013, 07:05 PM
JohnH's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Venezuela
Posts: 1,353
Thanks: 61
Thanked 106 Times in 85 Posts
Default

Good info. Thanks.
__________________
2010 GU Patrol ST 3.0 Auto
ARB Bar, LF Genesis HIDs, Front Air Locker, Snorkel, 3" exhaust, Tigerz11 Winch, Tough Dog 2" lift, Scan Gauge, Sliders, ST Maxx 285/70 17, Dual Batteries.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 16-12-2013, 05:17 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 27
Thanks: 3
Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts
Default

****
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 23-12-2013, 07:39 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: qld wandoan
Posts: 6
Thanks: 10
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

Hi mate great post I was looking for the answers you gave so hard to get straight answers was thinking of doing a lift on my 2012 y61 do you reckon the 3in lift is better all around than the 2in lift like yourself I do most of my driving on the tar and gravel roads but really want to get out in the bush beach and desert how much am I looking at paying for the 3in lift
Regards Martin
Wandoan QLD
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 31-12-2013, 03:41 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 27
Thanks: 3
Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts
Default

I went for the 3 inch because it gives you that little bit extra over the 2 inch but doesn't look to high and attract attention like a 4 inch lift will. Using the EFS kit off road is awesome wether articulating over the big lumps and bumps in low range or hitting faster sections of trails with corrugations and rocks.

Cost would be around $2600 for a 3 inch lift where you could do a 2 inch lift for $2100 depending on who you use and the quality of the suspension you choose.

If you go to a 4 inch lift add another $500 to $600 for adjustable pan hard rods.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 28-09-2014, 07:53 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: townsville
Posts: 11
Thanks: 1
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

So how do I straighten my steering wheel. I did 2" lift and wheel is not straight
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 28-09-2014, 08:23 PM
Overboard's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Townsville
Posts: 2,381
Thanks: 281
Thanked 580 Times in 423 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cyse View Post
So how do I straighten my steering wheel. I did 2" lift and wheel is not straight
Adjustable drag link.

Cheers,
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 20-03-2016, 07:26 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 27
Thanks: 3
Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts
Default

Hey guys,

I just thought I'd give an update on the performance of the lift, 3 years on and countless 4 x 4 adventures.

The vehicle is only used for recreation, which means trips to mountain bike parks, hauling our camper trailer or dragging the kids around as dad the taxi driver. We've done the Vic High country twice, and every 4 x 4 park in SE QLD! 30,000ks of adventure and not a single problem. The electronic traction control systems and ABS have not ever given any trouble under any circumstance and the vehicle is sitting level when measuring from the centre of the axle to the underside of the guard. I think the springs do settle a little post installation somewhere in the vicinity of an inch. With this in mind, the 3 inch lift raised the vehicle 4 inches by measurement immediately after the installation so it's fair that it settled over the next 3 years. The trailer we tow is 1100kg's and with the 3 kids and all the luggage we carry some weight so I'm happy with the performance. If you are thinking about going the extra inch over a 2 inch, I'd recommend it, the little bit of extra lift limits damage on the average track as the lower vehicles drag all the high points down. Anything too extreme is for the big rigs, so I avoid those tracks as you have to draw the line somewhere otherwise the modification never ends...... Cheers....
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to mad001 For This Useful Post:
jimbodeluxe (20-03-2016)
  #13  
Old 21-03-2016, 12:42 AM
guderiancol's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 852
Thanks: 1
Thanked 36 Times in 32 Posts
Default

dont for get... rear adjustable panhard, if not the rear axle go outside and worm upper and lower control arms bushes....
with 3" in front is not necessary in all cases, wheel alignment wil tell you about that
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 26-03-2016, 09:55 AM
nullack's Avatar
Y61=WIN
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Earth
Posts: 2,623
Thanks: 263
Thanked 471 Times in 328 Posts
Default

Doing a 75mm suspension lift on a vehicle with ESC is outside the guidelines of NCOP. It would require engineering certification by an appointed signatory and is not something which an owner can certify on their own to retain roadworthy status (if you care about that). I suspect any reasonable signatory would do lane change tests, brake tests/dive/squat tests at a minimum. It's likely the ESC would need some tuning. No offence mate, but I doubt your test process/reasoning to establish the test outcome that you think it's OK as it is. To say that your basis of being OK is that the fix to return the brake proportioning valve position back to OEM from the lift via a bracket, is to ignore well established facts of physics with vehicle dynamics. You can't magically resolve the changes in the centre of gravity, the extra amount of load shift in cornering, the increased amount of camber change you'll see with having more roll from the lift and so on that you've caused by doing the lift just by fitting a brake bracket buddy. All that device does, is change the amount of front and rear brake bias according to different cargo/people carrying loads that the vehicle will see from time to time. It's OK in your eyes because you want it to be OK, not because of test results establishing it is OK. It is possible to tune the ESC and people have cracked the NISSAN Consult II roms, but I'm not sure how far the Italians are into this area of the ROMs and more to the point, there is only two companies in Australia that I know of who actually have so called master keys for the Italian hack suite - you need the master keys to write custom ROM data. Most shops only have non master keys which only allows a bench ROM tune that a master key provider has supplied.

The way you have approached it mate isnt the only way it can be done. For other ways, for example how I did it, look at my build thread. E.g. I find value in having maximum rear articulation so I have drop out cones, coil retainers and extra long open length shocks in the rear. Eg 2: Running superflex radius arms in the front to improve upon poor OEM 3 link front articulation. Superflex retains the squat and dive benefits of a 3 link while resolving the bush binding/torque problem that restricts articulation. Eg 3: Using remote reservoir shocks to prevent overheat and cavitation of shocks so they dont fade as the Patrol is a heavy vehicle often driven at speed on dirt roads.

With spring rates, I think you'll find allot of value in rear airbags with the HD sleeves. This addresses your wise point of not overly hard spring rates but at the sametime allows for adjustment in the system for when you need it with big tow ball weight and being packed up loaded to the rim.

Well made coil springs will not "settle" as you put it. Well made springs will be through hardened in the heat treating, as well as fully scragged in manufacturing. A fully scragged spring won't sag after some cycles of use. That happens when they aren't scragged properly mate. My lift is four years old and I still have 75mm of lift.

I've been around patrols for more than two decades and have run all sorts of lifts in suspension and body lifts; both in LWB and SWB vehicles - SWB vehicles present particular challenges with suspension lifts. It isnt an unknown thing to do a Patrol lift the right way. Most of it is bolt on off the shelf with awesome products available. Some of it is weld on, but pre fabbed and no real hassle to fit up. I would say the list of needed parts should include heavy duty suspension and steering links, as the OEM design is badly lacking in that area, My build thread has a sample of failures that commonly occur from this.

Last edited by nullack; 26-03-2016 at 11:13 AM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiTweet this Post!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On







Subscribe in NewsGator Online


All times are GMT +10. The time now is 03:01 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO ©2010, Crawlability, Inc.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2016 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2016 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
 

Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.