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obi 1 patientnewby !
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Discussion Starter #1
The forum members that have 3 inch or more lift, how do you go for insurance?
Are you actually covered? or do you now an insurer that will cover your vehicle?
 

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'14 Y61 ZD30 CRD M/T ST
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I think you need to be a little more specific.

A 3" lift with 31" tyres is perfectly legal and should in theory be no issue with insurance. Just ask @geeyoutoo as that's what he's running.

If you combine a 3" suspension lift with a larger tyre, you run into legal issues, which then means you'd have to get it engineered to stand any chance of getting it insured.

I think it's safe to say no insurance company worth their weight would insure a vehicle for on-road use that is not legal.
 

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obi 1 patientnewby !
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Discussion Starter #3
I forgot to add the tyre size, At the moment I have 295/70/17.
I didn't think it would be covered, just thought I would ask anyway :)
 

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Nissan
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As far as I know it's max of 3" in NSW, combining tyre and suspension size upgrades, what I'm wondering though is what the max manufacturer tyre size is for a GU as a base point. If it's 31" then my 2" lift and 33" may be a problem. I can't remember what is stock and if there were a verity of sizes issued new. Can anyone clarify?

Having said that I haven't insured for donkeys years touch wood, and don't care to. But yep it's worth knowing and being aware of.
 

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Y2KGUII ZD Wgn
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I think you need to be a little more specific.

A 3" lift with 31" tyres is perfectly legal and should in theory be no issue with insurance. Just ask @geeyoutoo as that's what he's running.

If you combine a 3" suspension lift with a larger tyre, you run into legal issues, which then means you'd have to get it engineered to stand any chance of getting it insured.

I think it's safe to say no insurance company worth their weight would insure a vehicle for on-road use that is not legal.
I forgot to add the tyre size, At the moment I have 295/70/17.
I didn't think it would be covered, just thought I would ask anyway :)
My 265x75x16 come out at around 31.65" OD
The 295x70x17 come out at around 33.26" OD, so they would lift the vehicle around 0.8" more.
 

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nissan
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what I'm wondering though is what the max manufacturer tyre size is for a GU as a base point.
That's a very broad question, but the largest factory tyre size I'm aware of was 245/85/16 on some GU1 wagons (which would make 315/75/16 legal under the NCOP +7% rule)

527061
 

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'14 Y61 ZD30 CRD M/T ST
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Doesn't the tyre rule only apply to the largest tyre size placarded on the vehicle?

I'd also like to know how the cops detemine tyre OD when they pull you over. We all know that two tyres from two different manufacturers that have the same size specification do not necessarily have the same OD, so what do they use as a baseline?

@NissTorq there are hundreds if not thousands of GU Patrols running all around Australia with 2" lift and 33's and I've never heard of anyone having issues with that (apart from that one time a few years ago when QLD Police had a complete brain fart, maybe). I think that is generally considered to be acceptable.
 

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I'd also like to know how the cops detemine tyre OD when they pull you over. We all know that two tyres from two different manufacturers that have the same size specification do not necessarily have the same OD, so what do they use as a baseline?
Pretty sure they would just go of the size marked on the tyre. Obvioulsy imperial is easy and you have to do the calculation for metric.
Otherwise you would also have to take tread wear and tyre pressures into account. Or should we start running 35's at 15psi on the street and claim its legal because its not lifted the vehicle higher than stock.
 

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Pretty sure they would just go of the size marked on the tyre. Obvioulsy imperial is easy and you have to do the calculation for metric.
I would be very surprised if every cop on the street knows how to calculate a tyre OD from the side markings. We talk tyres all day on this forum and there are still A LOT of people on here who don't have a clue how to do it. I'd guess the police probably have some reference document / book with a table that they can look it up in.

Also, the general rule for most states say 75mm suspension lift, not 3". We interpret it as 2" suspension plus 2" tyre diameter (or 1" tyre radius), but the 75mm means that Mr. Police Officer also needs to convert imperial tyre sizes to metric to get an accurate number. I bet you it's all to hard. They'll want a "bible" to refer to.

Which then brings me back to my original question: If we are talking fractions of millimetres here (e.g. 75mm vs. 76.2mm) then the ACTUAL tyre diameter specification is what should be used, not the calculated value based on side markings.

Need to ask a cop... :unsure:
 

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When asking the engineer im using where he gets his measurements for suspension from he replied with this site. Apparently it shows wheel centre to wheel arch.
Unfortunately i couldnt get my car to come up so not sure if it has anything about tyres either.
 

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obi 1 patientnewby !
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Discussion Starter #12
My original tyre size is 275/65/17, which is 31.1 inch diameter.
My currant tyres are 33.3 inch diameter, so just over 2 inch larger, so even a 2 inch lift with those tyres, may be not be legal
 

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When asking the engineer im using where he gets his measurements for suspension from he replied with this site. Apparently it shows wheel centre to wheel arch.
Unfortunately i couldnt get my car to come up so not sure if it has anything about tyres either.
Yes, OEM's need to declare vehicle ride height for each variant, measured from the wheel centre to the point on the wheel arch directly above the wheel centre.

Here's the data for all Y61 (GU) Patrol Wagons.

And here's the same for Y60 (GQ).

My understanding is that this measurement defines the baseline for determining a suspension lift.

This document also defines the specific tyre size applied to each model variant which will be in line with what's posted on the tyre placard. (If different tyre sizes were optionally available, these would be shown as well.) I also believe that this is what's used to determine how much bigger you can go with tyres.

So in my case (2014 Y61 ST Wagon) the standard tyre size is 275/65R17. There are no tyre options available for my model, so I don't believe I can argue that a 245/85R16 should be used as a baseline.
 

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My original tyre size is 275/65/17, which is 31.1 inch diameter.
My currant tyres are 33.3 inch diameter, so just over 2 inch larger, so even a 2 inch lift with those tyres, may be not be legal
Again, in my case my standard and only tyre size is 275/65R17 which has a theoretical diameter of 789.3mm.

If I increase my tyre size by 7% I can go up to 844.6mm

I currently run 285/75R16 which is 833.9mm, so in tyre size I still have 10.7mm to play with.

Conversely, I'm allowed a total suspension height increase of 75mm. Currently 22.3mm of that [ (833.9 - 789.3) / 2 ] is in the tyre, so I can increase my suspension ride height (measured from the centre of the wheel to the wheel arch) by 75 - 22.3 = 52.7mm

This, I believe is why no one has any issues with the very common 2" lift + 33's on a Y61 Wagon.
 

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As far as I know it's max of 3" in NSW, combining tyre and suspension size upgrades, what I'm wondering though is what the max manufacturer tyre size is for a GU as a base point. If it's 31" then my 2" lift and 33" may be a problem. I can't remember what is stock and if there were a verity of sizes issued new. Can anyone clarify?

Having said that I haven't insured for donkeys years touch wood, and don't care to. But yep it's worth knowing and being aware of.
My original tyre size is 275/65/17, which is 31.1 inch diameter.
My currant tyres are 33.3 inch diameter, so just over 2 inch larger, so even a 2 inch lift with those tyres, may be not be legal

a 2” tyre increase only gives 1” of increased height. The other 1” is sitting at the top of the tyre not lifting anything (radius vs diameter)
The way you guys phrased it I wasn’t sure if you were aware of that.

so 2” suspension lift and 2” increase in tyre size = 3” overall lift.

So yes, in NSW a GU with 2” raised springs and 285/75r16 tyres is legal.
Other legal considerations I had were max decrease in rim size and max offset
 

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Hey mate yep right I recall that illusiory fact now, lot of these little points are so easily forgotten. I've found my memory a bit foggy of late and this is dejavu with patrol stuff which I was up on 5 years ago seems to be hard to recall. Thanks for the post
 

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Other legal considerations I had were max decrease in rim size and max offset
I'm not aware of any regulations or guidelines that dictate rim size changes. As long as the tyre size is within limits and the wheel has sufficient clearance to brake / suspension components there should be no issue. On a later model Y61 (post S4), I believe this pretty much limits you to a 16" wheel anyway.

You are allowed a maximum track increase of 25mm on the front axle (50mm on the rear of a Y60/Y61 because it's a solid rear axle), so you can change your wheel offset by 12.5mm assuming the tyre still sits inside the wheel arch and does not interfere with any suspension components.
 

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Y2KGUII ZD Wgn
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a 2” tyre increase only gives 1” of increased height. The other 1” is sitting at the top of the tyre not lifting anything (radius vs diameter)
The way you guys phrased it I wasn’t sure if you were aware of that.

so 2” suspension lift and 2” increase in tyre size = 3” overall lift.

So yes, in NSW a GU with 2” raised springs and 285/75r16 tyres is legal.
Other legal considerations I had were max decrease in rim size and max offset
It was mentioned in my earlier post (below), the .08 is half the difference in diameter between the two tyres compared.

My 265x75x16 come out at around 31.65" OD
The 295x70x17 come out at around 33.26" OD, so they would lift the vehicle around 0.8" more.
 

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This could all be interesting for guys with utes. How do they measure the back, particularly as I don't think there is any standard for tray height?
 

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When i got my old gq ute engineered for a 3" lift the engineer didnt know what to go off either. He just measured the front and put that down for the rear.
 
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