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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi guys, I've spent the last week or even more trying to read everything on here and all over the interwebs on this and I'm not sure which way to go. I know this is fraught with danger as if I'm not sure what I want from my wagon, how can I expect you to know and then advise me ??

This is not my daily ride and I'm looking to build a capable rig that goes where I point it. It needs good clearance for some pretty serious tracks but also needs good (as possible) road manners as most places are 150km plus away. It will get 35's, front locker, sliders, winch etc.

At the moment I'm looking at Dobinson springs, Amada Extreme, either hybrid or Superflex arms and adjustable most things underneath.

My concerns are;
- I've read a lot about people saying 3" is a great height, just as many say 4" is great...
- I've also read that a lot of people complain about sagging over a year or two.
- If I go for 3", I don't want to end up with a 2" wagon in 18 months time. (I've experienced this before with my last ute and I was chasing it for a while to get it right).
- If I go for the next level and get 4", the kit I'm looking at is labeled as 4-5". As much as I don't want a 2" wagon I do NOT want a 5" wagon.
- Stability on the tracks, it will most likely end up with a RTT at times, but not always.
- Unwanted police attention.

In my previous ute I had zero issues with the police as I kept it clean and tidy and it all looked "in proportion" even though it was quite big, I want the same with this one.

So after all that, what I'm looking for I guess is peoples experiences in what lift did you end up with compared to what you ordered or aimed for?

This needs to be a measured response, as in, if you told your suspension man that you had all these accessories and wanted 3", but really you didn't have them at the time but were planning on putting them on soon and then ended up with 4.5", I get that.

So how accurate are the leading manufacturers at matching springs to rigs and getting settled/finished heights right?

Thanks in advance.
 

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G'day Rod,
Yes, a non exact science.......
My GU7 had a 2" OME kit fitted from new, it got about 55mm lift in the rear (constant 200kg as I have drawers, fridge etc fitted.
However only got around 30mm in the front. I refused to accept this & made ARB fit front springs to suit a 4.2GU which lifted the truck around another 20mm.

The thing to keep in mind is your position with insurance.

Insurers will happily take your $ however it's all based on your duty of disclosure.
The moment you have an accident & you are over height or your tyres are too large in diameter you may find your claim refused & your policy cancelled.
Aside from the loss of your own vehicle you may end up paying for other vehicles as well as any other damages - there's a reason most policies include $10,000,000 to $20,000,000 in liability insurance.

In Vic we must adhere to the VSB14/NCOP guidelines, my 2" lift with 285/75/16's keeps me legal & roadworthy with a total lift within 75mm including tyres.

This is from the NSW VSi6 code;

SUSPENSION​
Item​
Modification​
12​
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]
Altering vehicle ride height by more than one third of the manufacturer’s suspension travel in the direction of the ride height change.​
[/FONT]​
[/FONT]Examples requiring certification: [FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Conversion from coil to leaf springs. [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial][/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Any modification to the suspension configuration. [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial][/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Fitting a suspension of a different design eg from a different make and model (eg from coil springs to leaf springs). [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial][/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Fabrication of suspension mounting points. [/FONT][/FONT]Examples not requiring certification: [FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Modification of suspension with components or parts which meet or exceed the original vehicle manufacturer’s specifications. [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial][/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Fitting uprated roll (sway) bars, shock absorbers, springs, struts or manufacturer’s options for that particular year make and model. [/FONT][/FONT]​

WHEELS AND TYRES​
Item​
Modification​
13​
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]
Replacement of tyres that change tyre overall diameter by more than 7% of the overall original diameter*. * ’overall original diameter’ means the maximum outside diameter of the largest tyre specified by the vehicle’s original manufacturer as an option for the vehicle, as shown on the vehicle’s tyre placard.​
[/FONT]​
[/FONT]Example requiring certification: [FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Replacing 215/65R17 (712 mm overall diameter) tyres with 265/65R17 (776 mm overall diameter) tyres, an increase in overall diameter of 64 mm, or 8%. [/FONT][/FONT]Example not requiring certification: [FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Replacing 215/65R17 (712 mm overall diameter) tyres with 235/65R17 (738 mm overall diameter) tyres, an increase in overall diameter of 26 mm, or 4%. [/FONT][/FONT]Tip: [FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]To determine if the tyres you have selected require certification you need to look at the tyre placard fitted to the vehicle by the manufacturer. Sometimes the tyre placard will show more than one tyre size, allowing optional tyres of that size to be fitted. If one of the tyre sizes marked on the placard (eg 215/65R17) matches the marking on the tyre sidewalls, certification is not required. [/FONT][/FONT]​

Sounds like the bigger tyres you wish to fit will not be legal, & you'll need to measure your bump stop clearances & then stay within only another 33% when you fit the higher springs.
If you wanted to go outside these guidelines & remain legal it sounds like you may need to engage an engineer.....

Good luck!
Matt
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks Matt. I'll deal with engineering in due course.

Right now I need to try and get an understanding of how accurate these guys are in getting the target heights. According to the salesmen out there they are spot on, foam shocks are the ducks guts and their suspension never sags like their competitors....
 

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I bought a 4-5" armada extreme stage 6 drop box kit from superior and told them all the extras (draws long range tank steel bar winch dual batt) and I was concerned about it being 5" lift to as that was not what I wanted I wanted 4" and they nailed it it is perfect shocks are a little harsh ride when car is totally empty and by empty I mean nothing no fuel & empty draws but that's rare it drives and handles awesome on 35" tyres and off-road goes anywhere.




09 GU Patrol standard

88 VX Sahara twin locked on 35's & lifted
 

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Points to remember is the main reason for lifting a vehicle is to clear larger tyres another advantage to lifting a vehicle is it will increase your approach and departure angle and vehicle hang up points, all 4 of which can also be improved upon with bar work and panel/ guard chopping. Then your larger tyres will lift your diffs up giving they are the lowest point.

For your particular GU7 2" lift will clear your 35" rubber with the use of two radius arm spacers, very easily. If on the other hand you want to sit higher then everyone else because it looks cool or tuff go for it, just drive it accordingly. I went 5" lift to allow for sag and a final ride height of 4" which is about correct with ARB comp coils. Anything 3" and above should clear 37" tyres with a bit more work but if 35" tyres is your desired size realistically you don't need to look past 2".

Good luck with getting manufactures to get it right with a one size fits all production of springs it just doesn't work like that. To do it correctly each corner needs to be weighed then you need to factor in your shock open and closed lengths and have springs made or find something thats going to suit your individual requirements. Every vehicle is different and will handle as such.

Just for reference 1" is about 25mm. So on my computer screen it would start about,
here
_





_
and finish here. Not a lot in it but it seems to make a lot of difference.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Walks, that's a nice looking truck you've got there, looks frigging huge :) what springs are you running?

Sydo and Jamie, that's 2 votes for Superior springs out of 4 posts, has to be something in that. What's the bit of info I'm missing? What shocks do you recommend to go with the a Superior springs?

Bogger, I hear what your saying about the bigger rubber and lower lift. In my last ride I used to bottom bounce my way along the trails with a 2" lift. Upped it to 3" and it was 500% better! still hit a bit but generally fine. It's a fine line between enough lift to do want you need and to much lift. I'm not out to lift it for the sale of it. As you say 1" or 25mm is only "that much" but the difference between 3" and 4" is huge, just look at Walks rig above, it's definitely noticeable.

Maybe 3" is the go...
 

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I bought a three inch kit a Christmas and was told the the superior coils don't come in heavy duty, so I went with a Dobinson and armada set up and am very happy with it, Just went to the cape and back. No probs. I went a three inch (gq patrol) to suit 35's but to have a compromise between tourer and tuff 4x4. It also looks low so as to not draw unwanted attention. I think a good setup and decent 35's is better than going for height.
 

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Rocket I'm running dobinson springs and yes it does look a little big but with 35's it's all in proportion and I've only attracted attention when I run my other play tyres






09 GU Patrol standard

88 VX Sahara twin locked on 35's & lifted
 

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Walks, that does look good but I think you need to update your signature line.

"09 GU Patrol STANDARD" Ha hhhhhhh ahhh Standard my a sss.
 

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That's 3" medium rate Dobinson coils with Hybrid Superflex arms. For me 3" is bang on the money. It'll clear 37's with some slight inside flare trimming, avoids unwanted attention, more stable on silly angles and drives better then new.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
MRY61, that looks pretty good. Have you got a side on shot? What shocks are you running? Is that on 35's in the pic?
 

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It's on 33's in that first photo, although here's a pic on 35's for you. I'm running Profender remote resoviour adjustables.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
That looks great on 35's. Sits really nice. :). How do you find the shocks? I'm also not completely sure which one to run as I've read the Amada's can be a bit firm.
 

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I find the Profenders excellent. The fact that they're adjustable is a bonus as well.
 
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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Thanks for the feedback MRY61. Something I think it would be much easier if there wasn't so many options and choices ;-)
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Well after doing plenty of reading from the experienced on here I thought I'd settled on a suspension setup. I'm running a steel Nissan bull bar, dual batteries, winch, Bolsy's sliders and eventually will end up with a rear bar and alloy Windcheater roof rack.

I was planning a 3" Superior kit with Superior springs, Profender Adjustables, hybrid Superflex arms, etc. etc.

That was until I rang Superior. I've rung them 3 times over the last 6 weeks, and received 3 different sets of info. The only consistency from them, was that my rig was too heavy for their springs, yet the public voice suggests otherwise. IF you want 4" Dobinson springs and Amanda Extremes you'll be fine. I've been told;

- their full kits include sway bar links
- their full kits don't include sway bar links
- drop boxes provide for a better ride as it makes the arm closer to parallel with the chassis
- drop boxes offer no advantages
- drop boxes are illegal, can't be mod plated
- drop boxes are illegal and can be mod plated
- Hybrid and Superflex arms are no good for anyone who travels more than 150km to their wheeling destination. They are so bad the sales rep said they wouldn't let their wife drive the car as I wonders continuously across the road. The wider public seems to suggest otherwise.
- Amanda Extremes don't have any issues with "weeping" around the canister joint
- Amanda Extremes are not harsh at all and are quite plush. Publi opinion suggest otherwise.
- Amanda Extremes are only harsh because a popular business vendor that buys lots of stock keeps supplying longer than recommended shocks for the lift and the piston is now running out of its optimatal position resulting in increased gas pressure. Obvious question - what about the harsh ride comments from shocks supplied by SE, and the answer - that's not the case.
- Profenders are a great adjustable shock and a genuine alternative
- Profenders are a ligh duty shock only suited to light rigs, "have you considered Tough Dog?"

Who the fire truck do you believe, the people who make/pedal this stuff, or the people who use it in the real world, as opposed to the real world of the manufacturer? ....
 
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