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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey Guys,

So on the weekend we were up at Bribie and as i was in 4x4 approaching 40-50km/h i noticed a clunking type noise as i backed off the throttle and was coasting.

When i got home i decided to check the grease in the uni joints and slip joint and go from there, so greased the unis and put 2-3 pumps in the slip joint and noise is still there.

Thinking that it was the transfer case or front diff i dropped the oils and they both looked ok (small amount of swarf on the magnetic drain plug)

The car has 3" superior springs in it and roadrunner 3-5" dropboxes. Adjustable panhards and draglink, Front and rear lockers and 33" MTZ.

I put the lift in about 12 months ago but havent really done much 4x4 since then so not sure if it was there after the lift or just occurred recently??

Does someone in Brisbane have some experience to help me solve it!

If it is the front tail shaft does someone have one they know works fine that i could pop it in and go round the block for a test drive?

Thanks Guys!

Jason
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
So i have also done some simple tests to try and isolate the issue:

2wd & Hubs Unlocked: No Noise
2wd & Hubs Locked: Noise at 40km and heavy vibration/rumble at 80km+
4wd & Hubs Unlocked: Noise at 40km and heavy vibration/rumble at 80km+
4wd & Hubs Locked: Noise at 40km and heavy vibration/rumble at 80km+

I removed the front shaft for the next tests:
2wd & Hubs Unlocked: No Noise
2wd & Hubs Locked: No Noise
2wd & Hubs Locked & Front Locker: No noise
4wd & Hubs Unlocked: No Noise
4wd & Hubs Locked: No Noise
4wd & Hubs Locked & Front Locker: No noise

I have also noticed that the front diff and transfer case flanges are at different angles?? would this also affect it? The drop boxes also do space the gearbox down a little bit too.
 

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Drop your front driveshaft out, lock the hubs in and go for a drive. The road will still spin the front diff.

That will help identify if the driveshaft is a problem of if the noise is inside the front axle housing.


***EDIT*** You just posted at the same time exactly what I posted.

Is the front shaft clearing the cross-member?
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Yes it looks like it is clearing it when i pulled it out, there are no rub marks on the shaft or cross member that i can see, i did have to flip the rear shaft as it was resting on the crossmember at full droop. but the front has 5-10mm or so clearance and prob 20mm at ride height
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
So does anyone on Brisbane north side have a front driveshaft that I could install on my car for a 5 minute drive around the block? I'll even take it off your car and reinstall it if you like, and I'll have a six pack for your troubles :)

Thanks guys.

Jason
 

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Mate short of a rear front diff bearing gone I think you have already found the problem. Front drive shaft. Have you spaced the gearbox down after the lift?
 

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I have the same problem; stock suspension. Like Franky said I presumed it was front drive shaft. the Uni joints should be pretty easy to move by hand, w/o any play. If not the joints probably need replacing. I haven't got around to doing mine so let me know how you get on.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Mate short of a rear front diff bearing gone I think you have already found the problem. Front drive shaft. Have you spaced the gearbox down after the lift?
The box is spaced down with the drop boxes (approx 6-8mm). Last night however i made some 12mm gearbox spacers out of a sheet of form ply (it was the only thickness i had at home) just as a test case and went round the block. Made no difference to the noise or vibration.

So if it is the drive shaft would anyone be able to lend me one for about 5 minutes to go round the block hehe.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Ok Guys.

I have been still trying to solve this one and have some new developments! Noise is till there after re greasing everything and driving it for a few weeks in and out of 4x4.

I caught up with a mate from my gym and we swapped the front tailshaft out of this GU ute into mine and you guessed it, noise is still there.

Our two trucks are very close to the same height within 5mm or so from hub to guard measurement. And looking at his truck the angles of the diff flange, transfer case flange and driveshaft angle appear to be very similar.

I have just received my magnetic angle measuring tool from fleabay today so will check the drive line angles and report back for some advise.

I have also noticed that sometimes if you hit a dip in the road in 4x4 this can cause the noise to start and stop if you are below the 40-50km speed. This could just be a co-incidence.

I dropped the fluid in the diff and the transfer case to see what they are like and the diff was clear and the transfer case was a little dark, but nothing too bad.

I took samples to my local gearbox place and they seemed to think they fluids looked ok.

I am at a loss..... any help???
 

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I really dunno mate. What are all the front bushes like?

Problems like this can be a real pain to track down so don't stress too much.

Are the tyres well balanced?
 

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Mate this really is a tricky one. I don't think it could be bushes as it would have happened even with the front driveshaft out. I was sure it must have been the front drive shaft after your thorough tests with it on and off in all scenarios. But the fact you have changed driveshaft's and the noise remains in the same way, leads me to think it has something to do with the driveshaft, but it isn't the problem. From what I can understand from your test, with the shaft in, the only time it doesn't do it is in 2wd unlocked. Short of taking the shaft off, as you did and the problem disappeared, this is the only time with it on the front final drive wasn't turning.

So what I am trying to say is that I think it could be an issue with the front final drive when the shaft is attached. More precisely at the back of the diff. Could there possibly be play in the pinion assembly. This could be caused by a loose pinion flange nut, or a flogged pinion gear bearing. If either of these were at fault, it wouldn't matter how well the shaft was balanced it would still happen, as the pinion assembly was still under load from the present spinning shaft.

The only other thing I can think of is exactly the same issue on the transfer case. Loose flange bolt or flogged output shaft bearing.

Will I just say that all of these ideas are unusual but possible.

Good luck. I'm still trying to track down a noise myself.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Good Morning Guys,

I got underneath the car last night and measured the diff and transfer case flange angles. I also compared them to my mate from gym and his angles were almost identical to mine. I quickly drew them up in Cad this morning to make it easier to understand.



The vertical difference in height is purely and approximation. But this is a fairly accurate representation of the drive shaft angle.

Is anyone else able to confirm their front driveline angles for comparison??

Does anyone know how to test for diff pinion bearing or transfer case output shaft bearing wear?
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I really dunno mate. What are all the front bushes like?

Problems like this can be a real pain to track down so don't stress too much.

Are the tyres well balanced?
Most of them if not all are relatively new as i have replaced most of the front end due to steering wobble issues i had in the past

Mate this really is a tricky one. I don't think it could be bushes as it would have happened even with the front driveshaft out. I was sure it must have been the front drive shaft after your thorough tests with it on and off in all scenarios. But the fact you have changed driveshaft's and the noise remains in the same way, leads me to think it has something to do with the driveshaft, but it isn't the problem. From what I can understand from your test, with the shaft in, the only time it doesn't do it is in 2wd unlocked. Short of taking the shaft off, as you did and the problem disappeared, this is the only time with it on the front final drive wasn't turning.

So what I am trying to say is that I think it could be an issue with the front final drive when the shaft is attached. More precisely at the back of the diff. Could there possibly be play in the pinion assembly. This could be caused by a loose pinion flange nut, or a flogged pinion gear bearing. If either of these were at fault, it wouldn't matter how well the shaft was balanced it would still happen, as the pinion assembly was still under load from the present spinning shaft.

The only other thing I can think of is exactly the same issue on the transfer case. Loose flange bolt or flogged output shaft bearing.

Will I just say that all of these ideas are unusual but possible.

Good luck. I'm still trying to track down a noise myself.
Let me know if you figure anything out!!!!
 

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Good Morning Guys,

I got underneath the car last night and measured the diff and transfer case flange angles. I also compared them to my mate from gym and his angles were almost identical to mine. I quickly drew them up in Cad this morning to make it easier to understand.



The vertical difference in height is purely and approximation. But this is a fairly accurate representation of the drive shaft angle.

Is anyone else able to confirm their front driveline angles for comparison??

Does anyone know how to test for diff pinion bearing or transfer case output shaft bearing wear?
My GU Wagon does the same thin.

I have always put it down to what you have drawn above.

Uni's don't like operating like that. Ideal world the pinion flange to transfer out put should be parallel.
eg if the transfer case pinion is pointing up at 3degrees the diff flange should point down 3 degrees
 

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Looks to me like you need double cardan joint on transfer case end of drive shaft. You can get these at Hardie Spicer outlets. Its to let shaft run at a proper angle so there is no stain on anything.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Can you simply replace the uni joint with a double carding joint ?? Or do u have to have the drive shaft shortened as we'll??

Or is there a bolt in replacement I could use from another model???
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
My GU Wagon does the same thin.

I have always put it down to what you have drawn above.

Uni's don't like operating like that. Ideal world the pinion flange to transfer out put should be parallel.
eg if the transfer case pinion is pointing up at 3degrees the diff flange should point down 3 degrees
I cant see any way in leveling out the transfer flange. And i would assume all GU's are set up the same as this??


The only way would be to lift the rear of the gear box up? Has any one done this before? And how did you do it? New gearbox mounts?

Thanks

Jason
 

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Sounds to me like the front diff pinion has not got the right angle. Have you spaced the front radius arms out about 10-15mm after the lift went in?
You are better off adjusting the diff end pinion because if you alter the gearbox end you will probably induce vibration into the rear tailshaft.
 
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