[Zd30 Steven]

What about putting the nozzle into the IC inlet end tank, this would work, it was atoss up between where I did it and there, I just had the room where I put it.

Not sure what you mean about end tank , if you can post a picture with a quick description. I’m thinking of teeing of after the solenoid using a t-piece for second nozzle? Not sure if that’s the way to go . Any ideas welcome mate, my current setup same as picture.

 

[geeyoutoo]

Not sure what you mean about end tank , if you can post a picture with a quick description. I’m thinking of teeing of after the solenoid using a t-piece for second nozzle? Not sure if that’s the way to go . Any ideas welcome mate, my current setup same as picture.

I'll take a pic of where I mean tomorrow.

 

[geeyoutoo]

@Zd30 Steven Here's a pic of mine showing the top rear tank, where I have put the circle is a good option for fitting the nozzle, as mentioned I considered this an option for mine. I'm not sure now what IC you have, maybe a HPD? if it is one of the type that have cast tanks you will have no need to add thickness like I had to, have a look and I think you would be able to add this even if the end tank is a rounded casting, close as possible to the air entry point so the water is carried by the air to the internal walls and fins. I'm fairly confident @OldMav would agree.

Just found a pic of a HPD for a DI and yes no worries fitting it in that area.

This is how mine was setup with pre turbo, if I go ahead with manifold injection I may re install the solenoid as an economy measure for trips.

 

[geeyoutoo]

EDIT: FORGET THIS ONE, WOULDN'T FULLY UTILISE BENEFITS.
WM Injection direct Into Manifold
As has been said many times, I'm not after 300rwhp, I love a project using gear I have or make myself, driveability for touring is the target.
OK so spent a couple of hours this morning analysing options so here are more random thoughts on WM injecting into ZD30DI manifold, not that easy as the manifold is a complicated design. The nozzle could be fitted into a modified TB and angled towards the manifold which also has the centre section cut out down the throat for around 30mm and plated above, this gives room to smoothly blend in the transition to both runners allowing even distribution of WM to all valves and runner walls. The use of Allen Head setscrews to attach TB to manifold gives a little more room to work with.

Manifold.

ThrottleBody. This is my original TB with butterfly removed, the one I have now has shaft and all lumps and bumps removed

 

[Zd30 Steven]

@geeyoutoo my IC is ASE(HPD) , that’s were I’m hoping to tap into but my have clearance issue from top as I don’t have the down side drop as your CCIC. I’m going to take some pictures later today of possible mounting spots. I’ve ordered some bits and pieces like tPiece and fittings to reconfigure setup. I’m going to borrow or buy a thread kit in the next couple of days. I did order a snow performance nozzle also in #1 as everything else I have is over DO5 and above. Not sure how to go about drilling into IC yet, but that seems the best way to go. Ok here’s some pictures of my IC , pick some locations for mounting nozzle spots.

 

[geeyoutoo]

@geeyoutoo my IC is ASE(HPD) , that’s were I’m hoping to tap into but my have clearance issue from top as I don’t have the down side drop as your CCIC. I’m going to take some pictures later today of possible mounting spots. I’ve ordered some bits and pieces like tPiece and fittings to reconfigure setup. I’m going to borrow or buy a thread kit in the next couple of days. I did order a snow performance nozzle also in #1 as everything else I have is over DO5 and above. Not sure how to go about drilling into IC yet, but that seems the best way to go. Ok here’s some pictures of my IC , pick some locations for mounting nozzle spots.

I reckon you have room right here. 90degree low profile attachment to nozzle. For drilling, grease on the drill bit and a piece of rag slid into the IC will do the trick.

 

[Zd30 Steven]

I reckon you have room right here. 90degree low profile attachment to nozzle. For drilling, grease on the drill bit and a piece of rag slid into the IC will do the trick.
View attachment 542376

Okay that’s perfect, there should be plenty of thickness there also, thanks for your help ✅. Is there a difference in thread between DO vs Snow nozzles?

 

[geeyoutoo]

Okay that’s perfect, there should be plenty of thickness there also, thanks for your help ✅. Is there a difference in thread between DO vs Snow nozzles?

I'll check tomorrow for you, for the CM I tapped 3/8" NF, from memory the Snow was 1/8" NPT, DO may be the same as Snow.

 

[Zd30 Steven]

I'll check tomorrow for you, for the CM I tapped 3/8" NF, from memory the Snow was 1/8" NPT, DO may be the same as Snow.

CM and DO are different, if snow nozzle is the same as DO that’s perfect,

 

[geeyoutoo]

@Zd30 Steven OldMav and I had another chat today rethinking your setup, can you take a pic and some measurements on the length of your IC inlet. We would like to set it up similar to mine where the spray will apply more to the back wall of the end tank. Sorry didn't measure threads today, will do it tomorrow and get back to you.

WM MANIFOLD INJECTION MK IV
Now forget my earlier thoughts on injecting into manifold. want to get as much spray (as is reasonably east to get) to spray on the walls of the runners. going to forget trying to use one nozzle as it is hard and maybe not as beneficial as first thought, so 2 nozzles into the individual runners will work and the places I've found to do it are accessible. I can also do it without stripping manifold off (of course with great care as usual).

This one could go in the other side of that port.

 

[Zd30 Steven]

Will take more pics tomorrow and measurements of inlet,

 

[geeyoutoo]

@Zd30 Steven just checked threads, DO and Snow are both 1/8" NPT on the bottom thread that screws into selected location, the CM is 3/8" NF. All are 1/8" NPT on the top thread that screws in hose fitting/adapter. I use AN4 braided line and fittings which are 1/8" NPT.

WM Manifold Injection Continued
This really looks like a good solution, bolted up spare TB and Inlet Manifold to check and I think this will work with minimum of fuss. I'm looking for 2 x CM1 nozzles. This solution will gratuitously coat the walls and I won't be using more water than I already do. Will investigate linking this to TPS (like pre turbo was) and changing the main jet to operate over a wider rampup range.

This was my original nozzle availability list, I've used DO, CM and Snow. For pre turbo I chose Snow as in my testing they gave the best atomisation which is what I wanted for pre turbo to limit possibility ofo compwheel vane tip damage, for anywhere else CM is great so seeing as the nozzles I'm actually using right now are CM I'm looking for a local supplier without success, the ones that were around seem to have closed up. Below is a list of nozzles and brands in a size I could use at various points.
DO Nozzles
0.75gph = 47.5ml/min
1.0gph = 63.3ml/min
2.0gph = 126.6ml/min
3.0gph = 189.9ml/min
4.0gph = 253.3ml/min

CM Nozzles
CM1 = 85 ml/min at 200psi
CM2 = 180-250ml/min
CM3 = 250-300ml/min
The injectors are sized CM1, CM2, CM3, CM5, CM7, CM10, CM12, CM14. The CM just means Coolingmist. The number is the flow rate in gallons per hour at 100 psi. The kit may run up to 200 psi which will give more flow. In simple terms the formula goes as follows. ie, the CM10, at 100 psi flows at 10 GPH at 150 psi its 12.2. The formula is 10*SQRT(150/100) at 200 psi that would be over 14. Just take the known flowrate (10 in this case) and then multiply it by the square root of the new pressure (150 in this example. You can do 200 if you like) divided by the known pressure.

Snow Nozzles
#1. 60ml/min
#2. 100ml/min
#3. 175ml/min
#4. 225ml/min
#5. 375ml/min

Clears everything

Under throttle body.

 

[Zd30 Steven]

Good work @geeyoutoo, Snow and DO same 1/8 NPT -27 thread , CM is different okay, that helps heaps thanks. Now here’s some more pics of IC inlet. Measurements :core L300xW280xH76 inlet pipe external diameter is 63mm.Last pic is internal diameter

 

[geeyoutoo]

An Observation of Intercooler Inlet Injection
As a spinoff from the Intercooler inlet injection there was another thing I noticed that I made a change to today. In the back of my IC years ago I had a 50c switch to control my underslung fan, I changed that to a 40c quite a while ago, came home the other day and when I turned engine off in the shed I didn't hear the fan wind down, turned ign back on and no fan, Oh well switch has dropped the bundle, so I put the 50c back in but didn't take much notice, yesterday fan not running again, it would appear that the WM spray which really coats the back wall where the switch is, is having an effect on the running of the fan. I tested both switches and they function perfectly so have put the 40c back in to keep fan running as much as possible, this has 2 benefits, 1 for performance and 2 for the fan bearings, the DI is not the smoothest idling/running engine so if the fan isn't running the bearings can get knocked around, I know this from experience which was why I put the 40c in to start with.

 

[Zd30 Steven]

The manifold location looks very appealing, much to thing about. Like IC inlet but manifold does seem more work .

 

[geeyoutoo]

FITTING WM NOZZLES INTO THE INLET MANIFOLD
Just to make sure people understand, I'm not suggesting do it this way, I'm suggesting it can be done this way in situ safely with appropriate care, I'm lucky that I have gathered spare throttle bodies, inlet manifolds and heads over the years to play with. At the end of this exercise there was no swarf to be found internally so this is the way I shall proceed when I get the nozzles I'm after, that may take some time, they just aren't around at the moment.

Rag stuffed down port into runner. 3mm pilot hole drilled with grease on the drill then the drill size for the chosen nozzle thread, for me it is 11/32" for 1/8" NPT (27 TPI). A plastic tube pushed over the drill to ensure only enough depth is used and grease put on the drill, and a vacuum cleaner hose at the port. Drill so far in then clean re grease and go again, do this several times till break through occurs. Then moved to the other port and followed same procedure.

Tapping time. Fully greased tap and followed same procedure for drill, in so far remove clean, grease and go again, little bit at a time.

After completing drilling and tapping a wire hook was used to 'gently' remove the rag in the runner.

Apart from nozzles I also require more fittings, there seems to be a supply issue with AN4 fittings at the moment as well.

 

[geeyoutoo]

Getting closer, only need an AN4 T piece and several olives for braided lines, ordered this morning from AutoBarn after having been everywhere to buy over counter. As mentioned earlier, damned nozzles are a big problem, deciding now between Snow 1 and Snow 2, but seeing as I can't find any I'm going to kick the experiment off using an old pair of DO nozzles I have, a 0.75 and a 1 these will give me a good idea on what way to go a bit later. Have double and triple checked all will fit in the confines, it is amazing what options you find if you keep looking. May start the real fitup next week.
EDIT: Meant to add, I'm going to put the larger DO into the square port runner, this runs across the head and picks up more heat which is why Nissan chose that design to send the EGR to just 4 back valves across the head. Could be feasible that in the long run a Snow 2 in the EGR side and a Snow 1 in the short side could have benefits.

 

[geeyoutoo]

WM Nozzles into Inlet Manifold, The Real Deal.

Got my AN4 bits, pulled IC and Throttlebody off yesterday and started the WM into manifold project. Had to make up new braided lines, ran into a few small annoying issues but as of 2 hours ago it is up and running, did a 50k test drive which took in my two long test hills, EGT likely dropped by another 10c on those long climbs (same weather conditions as the last test of pre IC injection so comparable), then came back to my flat ground test strip to do a series of time trials, very happy and a bit surprised, 4th gear 60-100k time has dropped by an average of .5 seconds, the surprising thing is these are small DO nozzles just as a test and it was straight water, I didn't put any Meth in last time I filled the tank. Of course I must consider water economy as I only have a 10L tank and I do a lot of trips but I think Snow 1 nozzles will be great. I did put the larger of the 2 DO nozzle into the port that feeds the back valves to give extra cooling there.

I'm happy with it, lot of fiddly work and I had to make some of it up as I went along, having the spare head and manifold sure helped but there is plenty you can't see under the IC and one thing caught me out, that was the underslung fan contacting one of the fittings to the top nozzle, I would drill the nozzle hole around 10mm lower than I did.
Followed procedure I wrote up earlier except that I added a piece of heater hose with 200mph tape to the vacuum cleaner to get closer to the drillings on the inside.Pilot holes, lots of grease on the drill, rags stuffed down the port and a small hyase attached to the vacuum cleaner.

Main tapping holes, again plenty of grease and around 3 separate drillings with more grease.

Tapping with even more grease again 3 different times. This was the easy one, the lower I couldn't (expectedly) get the T onto it so had to do it with a small spanner.

Nozzles fitted,

Hoses cut and assembled and Throttlebody back on. The nozzle I had originally in the TB removed and hole plugged, won't be using that again.

Pre Turbo WM injection system removed from inlet, won't be using that again either.

Assembled and ready to rock.

This is where I ran amok of clearance, the underslung IC fan was preventing the IC from being bolted down so I had to shorten the assembly by 8mm, drilling a bit further down the side would alleviate this as would using another nozzle style, the DO nozzles use the filter holder to secure the nozzle flow controller piece in place, other nozzles use a controller that screws in itself so no height issues, I cut the top off the filter holder and cut a screwdriver slot into it to hold it in firm. I don't use filters as I have an inline filter.
I can slip a ruler in between the nozzle bend and the fan housing so all good.

 

[Zd30 Steven]

Nice work mate, sounds very promising.

 

[geeyoutoo]

Nice work mate, sounds very promising.

I'm actually over the moon, unexpectedly high results, the manifold injection was a known quantity just always put it off for the 'engineering' reasons, but after the surprise results of changing to IC inlet in comparrisson to pre turbo I thought 'what the heck' and knowing the more you study something the easier it can be worked out sent me in this direction. It has also been great to get back some 'project enthusiasm'.
Bouncing ideas of OldMav helps a lot.