Lithium 12V Batteries Brands?

11716 Views 104 Replies 24 Participants Last post by rgren2, 2 mo ago

heyhey

Discussion Starter · Mar 4, 2022 (Edited)

I'm starting to see heaps of 12V Lithium Batteries hitting the market, most seem pretty reasonably priced and well spec'ed. Let's start a guide to what is out there, their specifications, cost and where to buy them. Any user experience and discussion would be good to. I don't want this to turn into a system discussion, just the batteries themselves. Any chat about charge controllers, BMS or installation should be directed elsewhere.

It would be important to list only 12V batteries, $ and Ah. That way east $/Ah can be worked out.

VoltX (first one I Googled)

outbax.com.au

NEW 2022 Design - VoltX 12V 100Ah Lithium Battery LiFePO4 Deep Cycle with Built-in BMS

3 Years Australian Warranty Rated Capacity 100Ah 12.8 Volts 306 x 169 x 215mm 13.5 kgs

outbax.com.au

$469 for 100Ah ($4.69/Ah)

Built-in Battery Management System protects against over-charging, over-discharge and short-circuiting
High quality prismatic cells
Up to 2000 Life Cycles
Can last up to 7 years

7-years doesn't seem very long for a lithium. My BYD home batteries are supposed to go over 10.

Reactions: 1

21 - 40 of 105 Posts

heyhey

Discussion Starter · #21 · Mar 8, 2022

Slimline is cheaper

www.aussiebatteries.com.au

175AH 12V Lithium Deep Cycle Front Terminal Battery| 12V 175AH Slimline Deep Cycle Battery Australia

175AH 12V AGM Slimline Lithium Deep Cycle Battery with AUSTRALIA WIDE DELIVERY. This 175AH LITHIUM Front Terminal deep cycle front terminal battery is built with a narrow profile and front mounted terminals for fitting into compact space. Shop our Slimline Deep Cycle Battery Range.

www.aussiebatteries.com.au

www.aussiebatteries.com.au

175Ah for $729 ($4.16/Ah)

robp9921

· #22 · Mar 8, 2022

heyhey said:
Slimline is cheaper

175AH 12V Lithium Deep Cycle Front Terminal Battery| 12V 175AH Slimline Deep Cycle Battery Australia

175AH 12V AGM Slimline Lithium Deep Cycle Battery with AUSTRALIA WIDE DELIVERY. This 175AH LITHIUM Front Terminal deep cycle front terminal battery is built with a narrow profile and front mounted terminals for fitting into compact space. Shop our Slimline Deep Cycle Battery Range.

www.aussiebatteries.com.au

175Ah for $729 ($4.16/Ah)

Good value-for-money on specs. Nice to see an Aussie company producing an internal BMS that will perform as a drop-in replacement for AGMs (albeit non underbonnet), yet still clearly warns about maximium SOC of 97% for an AGM charging profile.

Tworusty

· #23 · Mar 11, 2022

robp9921 said:
Yeah I agree re limiting scope. Suffice it to say if you're putting in a new battery, either a new installation or replacing an existing, the charging system and predicted load characteristics must be also considered, as, of course, your budget.

Regarding the DCS Extreme, not everybody's budget will stretch that far. For me, the expected life, its reliability and my cycle use makes it a viable (longer term) investment.
I have attached the specs for those interested.

Also, when I'm out bush I regularly go to areas where it's -5 deg C overnight. Permanent damage can be done when charging lithium batteries at low temps... DCS batteries are protected from this event.

And, they are an Aussie company, a BIG plus for me.

View attachment 540015

Yes DCS are possibly the best they guarantee suitable fort under bonnet most are not suitable because of the heat, from memory they have a video about testing under bonnet if you go to web site.

Mickhead

· #24 · Mar 11, 2022 (Edited)

Ampacity is a silly american word that describes the current carrying capacity of a cable. Has nothing to do with the amp hour rating of a battery.
Your DCS battery is made in China and also has a ling long BMS inside it. The only aussie made lithium is dug out of our ground and sent to China for processing.
Personally I will keep my LiFePo4 batterys in boxes and not under the bonnet, use them to run fridges and lighting, which they are very good at, hook them up to solar blankets or dc dc chargers, and rely on the trusty Optima which will last for 10 years to do the cranking.

andrew1964

· #25 · Mar 11, 2022

I have had a DCS 75ah under the bonnet of my GQ for two years now. I have run it down to 0% on a few occasions with no ill effects. It doesn’t seem to be affected by the heat, but none the less I have made up an insulating cover for it to protect it from radiant heat from the turbo. I keep it charged with a Projecta lithium dcdc charger which is IP67 and cheaper than the redarc. It does a good job, and also has a solar input. Couldn’t be happier with this setup at the moment, it runs two fridges and some camp lighting plus various chargers for phones etc.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Jeff Br

· #26 · Mar 11, 2022

OK, I am replacing My cranking Battery ASAP. The weight factor, is worth over $ 100, to save My back.
Did We come up with an Answer?

GQshayne

· #27 · Mar 11, 2022

andrew1964 said:
I have had a DCS 75ah under the bonnet of my GQ for two years now. I have run it down to 0% on a few occasions with no ill effects. It doesn’t seem to be affected by the heat, but none the less I have made up an insulating cover for it to protect it from radiant heat from the turbo. I keep it charged with a Projecta lithium dcdc charger which is IP67 and cheaper than the redarc. It does a good job, and also has a solar input. Couldn’t be happier with this setup at the moment, it runs two fridges and some camp lighting plus various chargers for phones etc.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

The ill effects of discharge down to 0% will be a reduction in cycles. Obviously the effects will be dependant on how often it happens,

Reactions: 1

Benny Jahmin

· #28 · Mar 15, 2022

Just come across these.

megalifebattery.com.au

MV-31R

Direct replacement Lithium Iron Phosphate (LiFePO4) battery designed for large vehicles and 4x4. Versatile match D31 and N70ZZ case sizes covering the most common SUV and ute battery size on the market. Suits many large passenger cars and 4x4 utilities without modification.

megalifebattery.com.au

They are claimed as direct replacement so I assume are warranted for under bonnet use. But the big draw card is the built in reserve/jump pack. So essentially cutting out the need for a second battery all together assuming 60ah is enough for your needs.

heyhey

Discussion Starter · #29 · Mar 15, 2022

andrew1964 said:
I have had a DCS 75ah under the bonnet of my GQ for two years now. I have run it down to 0% on a few occasions with no ill effects. It doesn’t seem to be affected by the heat, but none the less I have made up an insulating cover for it to protect it from radiant heat from the turbo. I keep it charged with a Projecta lithium dcdc charger which is IP67 and cheaper than the redarc. It does a good job, and also has a solar input. Couldn’t be happier with this setup at the moment, it runs two fridges and some camp lighting plus various chargers for phones etc.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

It is impossible for batteries of any sort to not be affected by heat. The BMS might manage the charge/discharge of the battery, but it cannot alter the chemistry and environmental effects of the cell.

I reckon the DCS price premium is an insurance cover or opportunity to make money before it's found that an electronic board cannot change the effect of temperature of the cell and it only derates charge/discharge which many 'ling-long' BMS have been proven to do. I wanna see a side by side to destruction test before I would fork out double the price.

andrew1964

· #30 · Mar 15, 2022

heyhey said:
It is impossible for batteries of any sort to not be affected by heat. The BMS might manage the charge/discharge of the battery, but it cannot alter the chemistry and environmental effects of the cell.

I reckon the DCS price premium is an insurance cover or opportunity to make money before it's found that an electronic board cannot change the effect of temperature of the cell and it only derates charge/discharge which many 'ling-long' BMS have been proven to do. I wanna see a side by side to destruction test before I would fork out double the price.

I don’t know their prices now, but when I bought mine it was a middle of the range price, not the cheapest and a long way from the most expensive. So I wouldn’t have described it as a premium price. I know that prices have tumbled in the last couple of years, so I don’t know where they sit now.

I know that all batteries are affected by heat, I never claimed otherwise, that’s why I made up an insulating cover for mine. DCS have rated theirs for under the bonnet use, so maybe the have included some sort of insulation inside the case? I don’t know. But I did a fair bit of research and I’m happy with my choice. If I could find room in the back of the wagon I would put it there, but I can’t. At the time, the only slimline available was close to 2k. There’s a lot more choice out there now, so when this one dies I’ll be able to revisit that option.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

GQshayne

· #31 · Mar 30, 2022

What do you blokes reckon of these??

GIANT 130AH Lithium Deep Cycle Battery | 130AH Lithium Battery Australia | 130Ah Lithium (LiFePO4)

GQshayne

· #32 · Mar 30, 2022

This one looks to be good value for money.

GIANT 100AH Lithium Deep Cycle Battery | 100AH Lithium Battery Australia | 100Ah Lithium (LiFePO4) (aussiebatteries.com.au)

GQshayne

· #33 · Apr 1, 2022

@heyhey and @Yeti's Beast do you fellas have an opinion on the batteries I listed above?

I have looked at the Atlas 75ah, but it listed only 1600 cycles which seemed very low. Is that right, or have I misread the spec? The Giant stuff has 5000 cycles form what I can see.

heyhey

Discussion Starter · #34 · Apr 1, 2022

GQshayne said:
@heyhey and @Yeti's Beast do you fellas have an opinion on the batteries I listed above?

I have looked at the Atlas 75ah, but it listed only 1600 cycles which seemed very low. Is that right, or have I misread the spec? The Giant stuff has 5000 cycles from what I can see.

Firstly I take their specs with a grain of salt. "130% usable capacity" is not a thing haha. Otherwise, I've had good experiences with their AGM stuff over the years.

Yeah those Giant ones have much better specs even though listed capacity and continuous discharge are the same. The fact they list a Daly BMS is also a good thing for the Giant IMO. For the extra $30 I'd get the Giant over the Atlas. It's a pretty good offering if the specs hold up.

Reactions: 1

GQshayne

· #35 · Apr 2, 2022

I did notice the 130% thing. LOL

Bond

· #36 · Apr 7, 2022

Most of the guys on here are pretty handy and could do a much better job of building a battery than a chinese factory.

You can build a high quality 280ah Lifepo4 battery for under $1,200. I just tested mine pulling 200amps for 30 minutes and it does it without breaking a sweat. BMS rose 8 degrees in an enclosed battery and voltage was still at 12.75

Reactions: 5

Benny Jahmin

· #37 · May 23, 2022

Just ordered a dcs 75ah and enerdrive dcdc 40A charger.
I was thinking of just getting the 50ah battery as they can be drawn down 100% which makes it equivalent to a 100ah agm. Which most people have used successfully for the past 30 years.
All I will be drawing is a 40l fridge and typical phone / ipad chargers.
The quick charge rate and my current usage should have seen the 50ah fine. It does only have a 50amp max draw and can't be used for jump starting. I thought I would make a quick call to dcs who were extremely helpful. What I wanted to know was if I connected 2 x 50ah to make a 100ah would I then be able to draw 100a and possibly jump start. But because of the size constraints the BMS is limited to 50a and not suitable to jump start.
In the end I decided to spend a little more and get the 75ah which gives a little more peace of mind and more than enough power for our needs.

geeyoutoo

· #38 · May 23, 2022

Benny Jahmin said:
Just ordered a dcs 75ah and enerdrive dcdc 40A charger.
I was thinking of just getting the 50ah battery as they can be drawn down 100% which makes it equivalent to a 100ah agm. Which most people have used successfully for the past 30 years.
All I will be drawing is a 40l fridge and typical phone / ipad chargers.
The quick charge rate and my current usage should have seen the 50ah fine. It does only have a 50amp max draw and can't be used for jump starting. I thought I would make a quick call to dcs who were extremely helpful. What I wanted to know was if I connected 2 x 50ah to make a 100ah would I then be able to draw 100a and possibly jump start. But because of the size constraints the BMS is limited to 50a and not suitable to jump start.
In the end I decided to spend a little more and get the 75ah which gives a little more peace of mind and more than enough power for our needs.

So are you saying the 75ah battery cannot be drawn down 100%?

Benny Jahmin

· #39 · May 23, 2022

geeyoutoo said:
So are you saying the 75ah battery cannot be drawn down 100%?

No all of their batteries claim 2500 cycles at 100% dod.
I was just suggesting that 50 'useable' amp hours is pretty much what every tourer was running until recently.

Reactions: 1

Bond

· #40 · May 23, 2022

Benny Jahmin said:
Just ordered a dcs 75ah and enerdrive dcdc 40A charger.
I was thinking of just getting the 50ah battery as they can be drawn down 100% which makes it equivalent to a 100ah agm. Which most people have used successfully for the past 30 years.
All I will be drawing is a 40l fridge and typical phone / ipad chargers.
The quick charge rate and my current usage should have seen the 50ah fine. It does only have a 50amp max draw and can't be used for jump starting. I thought I would make a quick call to dcs who were extremely helpful. What I wanted to know was if I connected 2 x 50ah to make a 100ah would I then be able to draw 100a and possibly jump start. But because of the size constraints the BMS is limited to 50a and not suitable to jump start.
In the end I decided to spend a little more and get the 75ah which gives a little more peace of mind and more than enough power for our needs.

I have tested my home made 105ah lifepo4 battery to around 200amps with no issues. They are rated to 3c for short bursts.

Reactions: 1

21 - 40 of 105 Posts