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The Googlest, Apparently!
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Discussion Starter #1
OK, so looking to go down the camper trailer route.

Hate caravans and cant take them were I want to go.

So camper trailer is it.

The wife, on the other hand, wants a caravan with all the mod cons, including AC.

But that aint gonna happen.


Therefore for me to coax her into a camper trailer I will need AC as she suffers in heat and humidity. (I know, this is Oz and it what we have in abundance, but her dainty Scottish tush can't take it)

That means portable AC and a Genset.

I have been looking at this and know that to have any success I will need to get something in excess of 16,000 BTU's to cool what is effectively a tent.

Thinking of something like this.

https://www.kogan.com/au/buy/kogan-16000-btu-portable-air-conditioner/

16,000 BTU needs roughly 1800W / 9A input power.

But when the compressor and fan kicks in there would be an extra surge draw, possibly another 400/500W and 2A.

For this I think that a 3Kva inverter generator would be the go.

Like this.

https://www.4wdsupacentre.com.au/adventure-kings-3-5kva-3500w-generator.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIw93tzfnr2AIVE5a9Ch0QhgSiEAQYASABEgKXJ_D_BwE

It would also allow me to run a bunch of power tools (drill / grinder / metal nibbler etc) for repairs on the go, maybe even the wifes hair drier lol.

Anyone have any experience with this sort of set up?
 

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I have a caravan with an Aircommand Heron 2.2 split aircon with a rated cooling capacity of 2.7kw. It has a max rated cooling current of 4.0 amps. My Yamaha EF2000iS will not run it even though it has a maximum current output of over 8 amps. Starting load for the compressor is just too much. The Yamaha EF2400iS will run it just fine which surprised me a little as the aircon compressor had a locked rotor current of 20 amps and the EF2400iS had a maximum output current of only 16 amps . Unfortunately the only way to know for sure if your aircon will work with a particular inverter generator is to try it.
 

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Here To Be Entertained
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Smaller than what you are looking at but for a bit of feedback, I bought this one a few months ago for the same purpose. Will be going inside the Jayco camper so probably a bit less space to cool.
https://www.kogan.com/au/buy/kogan-10000-btu-portable-air-conditioner/

Haven't tried it in the glamper yet, but gave it a good run at home. Poor thing was trying to cool internal stairwell, kitchen, dining, living and hallway and have to say it wasn't going too bad :D so the 16000 btu one should cruise it in.

If you can keep as much of the outlet pipework as possible outside it would make a huge difference as it gets pretty warm so would compound the heat.
 

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The Googlest, Apparently!
nissan patrol
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Yep, the outlet would be very short, no point heating up the place you are trying to cool. I think the 16,000 is only just enough as well, canvas is a whole different ball of wax to a solid wall when it comes to insulation.

She will have to sit in front of it to get anything is my belief.

But the main thing I am getting at is the current draw at start up, as Overboard has pointed out.



Overboard. Good info, and confirms what I was thinking.

From your example it is not too hard to work out.

Your 2000 will put out 4.1amps at the nominal 1.6kVA / 240volts, and peak (2kVA) is 8.3amps, which is not enough to kick in the compressor.

But your 2400 is with 8.3 and 10 amps respectively will.

(KVA x 100) / Volts) = Amps

So the extra 1.7amps is all you need for the 2.6kW output of your AC (10a x 240v = 2400w compressor output, which is what the Aircommand Heron is rated at).

Thus, you have to have the compressor output rating or you are not going anywhere. (was hoping there is a little fudge factor going on)

The peak load of the Kings 3.5kVA is, well, 3.5kVA, or 14.5amps. So, 14.5 x 240 = 3480W

The 16,000btu AC is 4.7kW at the compressor.

So, I will need a bigger generator.

Which is the big problem, to step up in output you go from a 50kg genset to a 100kg+ genset, and it is not so portable anymore. :(

Or go to a smaller AC, but see reply to Guey ...
 

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what about something like a chinese knock off of a truma ducted reverse cycle from a caravan. space wise would be perfect for a camper, and someone with your fab skills I'm sure could make it work quite well
 

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Might sound silly but have a look at small split system, they run inverters and big startup currents are reduced
 

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The Googlest, Apparently!
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Discussion Starter #8
what about something like a chinese knock off of a truma ducted reverse cycle from a caravan. space wise would be perfect for a camper, and someone with your fab skills I'm sure could make it work quite well
Might sound silly but have a look at small split system, they run inverters and big startup currents are reduced
Have a look at one of these


Sent from my LG-K520 using Tapatalk
Gents, you are missing the point.

I will need somewhere in the vicinity of 16,000 BTU's to make a dent in temperatures under a canvas.

the Truma Saphir is 2400W.

1W = 3.412 BTU's, therefore the Truma is 8188.8 BTU's.

There is a huge difference in cooling the area of a canvas tent, compared to the area inside an insulated wall of a caravan.

Not to mention that the Kogan jobbie is a third of the price for twice the BTU's...

And the Kogan is a small split system, without the split. Very hard to run a bunch of lines through the tent access and keep it sealed. The exhaust is not such a problem.
 

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Your 2000 will put out 4.1amps at the nominal 1.6kVA / 240volts, and peak (2kVA) is 8.3amps, which is not enough to kick in the compressor.

But your 2400 is with 8.3 and 10 amps respectively will.

(KVA x 100) / Volts) = Amps
1.6kva is 6.7a @ 240v not 4.1a but you are right that it is still not enough.



So the extra 1.7amps is all you need for the 2.6kW output of your AC (10a x 240v = 2400w compressor output, which is what the Aircommand Heron is rated at).
You are mixing up cooling kw with electrical kw. they are not the same.

I will need a bigger generator.
Your calculations are based on cooling kw being the same as electrical kw when that is not the case. I would do some experimenting before i went and bought anything. It is easy to hire a variety of inverter gensets but from past experience the only portable aircons I could hire easily were way bigger than you need. Maybe an aircon salesman will let you plug in some demo units to see what copes.

I have run a 20 foot donga with aircon, fridge, computers etc. off a 3kva inverter generator with success. I don't remember the size of the aircon but I'd say it was at least 12000BTU.
 

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I Have Imaginary Friends
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I have the carby version of this. It runs the airconditioner in my caravan. I also use it for the house when we have blackouts, (had an electrician wire up the board so just requires the 15amp cord to be plugged in and a switch thrown), the start battery is a little tired now so I have an anderson plug on it and use a portable battery box. It has a recoil starter but I'm too lazy to use it. I'd rather buy four of these than one Yamaha or Honda. Have not had a problem with it in the four years I've owned it. I was using it once a fortnight to run my still because it was cheaper to run than pay Ergon.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/NEW-EFI-FUJI-MICRO-Inverter-Generator-3-7kVA-Max-3-2kVA-Rated-Portable-Camping/161052730446?epid=1142376002&hash=item257f7da44e:g:DSEAAOSwXkNaZb8Z
 

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The Googlest, Apparently!
nissan patrol
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Discussion Starter #11 (Edited)
Yep, my bad on the 1.6kva calculation. Fat fingers on the calculator ...

And no, I am not confusing anything with anything, Cooling kw is not the same a electrical kw, and that was why I posted as I did not know how to link them (it is 42 years since I finished my apprenticeship and that was the last time I worked as a sparky as well). If it was as straight forward as that then I would have had no need to post.

But I could draw a correlation through your example as I posted in reply.

However, even then there are the variables in the design of the different AC's; motor, compressor, refrigeration unit efficiencies, friction losses and on and on.

One manufacture of a 10,000 BTU unit may need more power to run than a 10,000 BTU unit of another manufacturer. And that is a fact.

The compressor output is not output per se, it is the cooling system's ability to remove heat.

How much input power is required to run 4.7kW of heat removal given the variables?

That is the question.
 

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The Googlest, Apparently!
nissan patrol
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Discussion Starter #12
I have the carby version of this. It runs the airconditioner in my caravan. I also use it for the house when we have blackouts, (had an electrician wire up the board so just requires the 15amp cord to be plugged in and a switch thrown), the start battery is a little tired now so I have an anderson plug on it and use a portable battery box. It has a recoil starter but I'm too lazy to use it. I'd rather buy four of these than one Yamaha or Honda. Have not had a problem with it in the four years I've owned it. I was using it once a fortnight to run my still because it was cheaper to run than pay Ergon.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/NEW-EFI-FUJI-MICRO-Inverter-Generator-3-7kVA-Max-3-2kVA-Rated-Portable-Camping/161052730446?epid=1142376002&hash=item257f7da44e:g:DSEAAOSwXkNaZb8Z
Aye, not that impressed with Yam or Honda either, that is why the Kings gets the nod, it's cheaper even if I don't know how good it is.

But your Fuji is a comparable price.

Do you know what the rating is of your caravan AC is? (BTU or kW will do).
 

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I'll check it in the morning.
 

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The Googlest, Apparently!
nissan patrol
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Discussion Starter #14

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The Googlest, Apparently!
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Discussion Starter #16
Not sure what your budget is, but have you looked at buying a camper trailer with air con already fitted. I remembered looking at an suv brand forward at a show a while ago with it installed.

Here's the link to the specs:
SUV FORWARD FOLD GRAND - Guardian Campers & RV Centre

It is chinese import, but I saw you are considering an mac also.
Never thought of that.

The link is definitely in the budget, though I see no AC on the specs.

But even so, as an add on it should still be within what I want to pay.

Thanks.
 

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The Googlest, Apparently!
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Discussion Starter #18

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Aye, not that impressed with Yam or Honda either, that is why the Kings gets the nod, it's cheaper even if I don't know how good it is.

But your Fuji is a comparable price.

Do you know what the rating is of your caravan AC is? (BTU or kW will do).
Not much info in the manual.
 

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Not much info in the manual.
The important info there is the cooling capacity of 3.2kw and the L/R (locked rotor) amps which is 20a. This is the same as my 2.7kw cooling split aircon and is easily started with a Yamaha 2400w inverter genset. I'd say there will be no problem running that with any noname inverter genset of 3000w or better.
 
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