[Ethanissan]

A couple of videos on a small downhill side track on Fraser, on two seperate days. Gets the axles crossed up and shows full flex both ways, just for a bit of fun. This is with the swaybar connected too. The first vid is with a less than ideal cameraman, but shows better side shots of flex, and the second has better camera handling, but shows more from the front.

 

[Johan Safari]

 

[Ethanissan]

View attachment 538695

Hopefully I can achieve something similar with my new shackles when I get them, and shocks. I found out yesterday that I have parabolic leafs front and rear, still a super rough ride though, but it means they should be able to easily bend and flex , even as a spring under axle.


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[Johan Safari]

Found a few more flex pictures... (just to show off...)

Ground clearance and approach and departure angles required for this.

\

Bonus: LWB stock Terrano flex. Coils rear and IFS front. Left front in the ditch and right rear just in the air.

 

[Marko_SJ]

Hopefully I can achieve something similar with my new shackles when I get them, and shocks. I found out yesterday that I have parabolic leafs front and rear, still a super rough ride though, but it means they should be able to easily bend and flex , even as a spring under axle.


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What shackles? I hope not drop shackles lol.

 

[Ethanissan]

What shackles? I hope not drop shackles lol.

Nope, I've ordered a set of superior +2" extended shackles which should just allow the leaf to extend and pull back a bit more, and possibly give a little more on-road comfort if I can ever get around to relocating the chassis mounts to give a bit more angle at resting height.
Just out of curiosity though, what's wrong with drop shackles? From what I know about them they can be locked into the 'closed' position so they effectively become standard shackles, and then a pin can be pulled out to let them drop out when 4wding.

 

[Marko_SJ]

Nope, I've ordered a set of superior +2" extended shackles which should just allow the leaf to extend and pull back a bit more, and possibly give a little more on-road comfort if I can ever get around to relocating the chassis mounts to give a bit more angle at resting height.
Just out of curiosity though, what's wrong with drop shackles? From what I know about them they can be locked into the 'closed' position so they effectively become standard shackles, and then a pin can be pulled out to let them drop out when 4wding.

It gets a bit technical but read the linked thread. The OP custom coils and custom builds leaf spring suspensions on Suzuki's (as well as Rovers) to drive extreme tracks in the Vic high country.

auszookers.com • View topic - The uncontrolled travel thread.

Long and short of it "dropping out" doesn't add much traction and can cause the car to flop.

Basically for leafs you want to set an ideal shackle with the longest spring possible to fit in the perches (many models guys cut the front spring perches off to fit the longer rear springs in the front to gain articulation, this is known as a RUF)

I read somewhere Hilux springs are longer than MQ/MK and can be used.

This stuff will possibly require fab.

 

[Ethanissan]

It gets a bit technical but read the linked thread. The OP custom coils and custom builds leaf spring suspensions on Suzuki's (as well as Rovers) to drive extreme tracks in the Vic high country.

auszookers.com • View topic - The uncontrolled travel thread.

Long and short of it "dropping out" doesn't add much traction and can cause the car to flop.

Basically for leafs you want to set an ideal shackle with the longest spring possible to fit in the perches (many models guys cut the front spring perches off to fit the longer rear springs in the front to gain articulation, this is known as a RUF)

I read somewhere Hilux springs are longer than MQ/MK and can be used.

This stuff will possibly require fab.

Huh, that's a really good read, and totally makes sense. For me at least, I love knowing all the technical little details and physics on how things work, so that write-up is super interesting, and I understand now why drop shackles aren't as good as they're made out to be.
I've also read about the Hilux springs, but I can't find anywhere what actual model everyone refers to, they just say "Hilux rear springs". @james008 do you know what model Hilux spring is an upgrade to the front of an MK, and is it bolt-on with longer shackles? Only reason I ask you is because you know everything else about these, so I figure you might know about this as well

 

[Johan Safari]

1.2M cross axle articulation limited by the length of the longest shock I could fit without cutting the body is enough. With the shocks disconnected it did 1.4m and the perches removed, who knows. You really don't need Hilux leaves.... If you want better, go 4 link or something, but that will probably not go down well with the ADR again. I originally went SOA because the front wheels got stuck inside the front wheel wells in the fenders preventing me from turning the steering. I had the same issue even after the SOA so I fitted perches to prevent this. The perches serves to functions, prevent wheels rubbing and going past the shock upper limit.

Right front wheel on the perch and shock fully compressed

Front perch

Rear perch - note the shock mount the same as the bottom of the axle tube. I had to weld plates on top as it bend the original perches.

 

[Ethanissan]

1.2M cross axle articulation limited by the length of the longest shock I could fit without cutting the body is enough. With the shocks disconnected it did 1.4m and the perches removed, who knows. You really don't need Hilux leaves.... If you want better, go 4 link or something, but that will probably not go down well with the ADR again. I originally went SOA because the front wheels got stuck inside the front wheel wells in the fenders preventing me from turning the steering. I had the same issue even after the SOA so I fitted perches to prevent this. The perches serves to functions, prevent wheels rubbing and going past the shock upper limit.

Right front wheel on the perch and shock fully compressed
View attachment 538919

Front perch
View attachment 538921

Rear perch - note the shock mount the same as the bottom of the axle tube. I had to weld plates on top as it bend the original perches.
View attachment 538922

Yep I know that the Hilux leaves won't be super useful in getting extra travel because of shock limitaions, I'm more interested in the extra shackle angle that may be gained by the length, for extra softness and comfort on the road.

 

[Johan Safari]

With 2" longer shackles and the right arch, you will get around a 15 degree forward angle with standard length leaves. Perfect for both up and down articulation and a very soft ride....

 

[Ethanissan]

Since the spring reset, and rear single leaf removal, my rear end flex has improved a lot. It now hits the bump stop because the spring rate is lower (1 less leaf in the pack, and it was the stiffest one there), and maxes out the standard-length shackle (so should get even more down-travel once my superior shackles arrive).
Before and after photos of flex: (front hasn't changed, it always would get full bump stop compression and shock extension no problem, but the rear has improved)
Before:

After: (camera angle makes it look even better lol)

I'm so happy with how well the rear end drops out of the guard now:

And stuffs further into it too:

Oh yeah, it's all coming together...

 

[neRok]

I've also read about the Hilux springs, but I can't find anywhere what actual model everyone refers to, they just say "Hilux rear springs".

There was nothing special about Hilux springs apart from the fact they were available and suitable (same width, and appropriate extra length). But this was over 10 years ago, and there are a lot more springs to chose from these days (because a lot of dual cabs still use leaf rears) and they have better "technology" in the design of the leafs and packs. So if you're going that "hardcore" mod route (beyond bolt-in), I would be looking for better alternatives, front and rear. You might even be able to pinch some lightly used stockers out the scrap bin at ARB or something!

There was a thread where I rummaged through various catalogues trying to find good options, but I can't remember the name of it. I remember that user Baja Burley was interested in doing spring swaps at the time, which is why I was looking, and he eventually did do a RUF, then use hilux springs. You might have seen his build thread? Baja Burley's truck!!

There was an even older forum called Outerlimits4x4, and there were some blokes/threads on there that did some pretty hardcore suspension mods (which is probably where the initial idea of hilux springs came from), but that forum is long dead.

 

[Ethanissan]

There was nothing special about Hilux springs apart from the fact they were available and suitable (same width, and appropriate extra length). But this was over 10 years ago, and there are a lot more springs to chose from these days (because a lot of dual cabs still use leaf rears) and they have better "technology" in the design of the leafs and packs. So if you're going that "hardcore" mod route (beyond bolt-in), I would be looking for better alternatives, front and rear. You might even be able to pinch some lightly used stockers out the scrap bin at ARB or something!

There was a thread where I rummaged through various catalogues trying to find good options, but I can't remember the name of it. I remember that user Baja Burley was interested in doing spring swaps at the time, which is why I was looking, and he eventually did do a RUF, then use hilux springs. You might have seen his build thread? Baja Burley's truck!!

There was an even older forum called Outerlimits4x4, and there were some blokes/threads on there that did some pretty hardcore suspension mods (which is probably where the initial idea of hilux springs came from), but that forum is long dead.

I wonder then if there's a leaf spring that's the right width, has the locating pin in the right spot for the axle, and has slightly more length to allow a little better shackle angle with extended shackles and stock shackle mounts? I'll have to do some measuring at some point to figure out the dimensions of my stock springs, and have a snoop around the internet to find anything that might suit. As you say, there's so many dual cabs running around nowadays there's probably more chance something will fit without modification, than there is that nothing will. Depends whether the general construction of leafs in general has changed though, I seem to have noticed many have an extremely wide profile compared to the older leafs, or maybe it's just my imagination?