I Have Imaginary Friends
Nice work, my second battery is in the chassis rail under the rear passenger side, frees up a bit of room in the engine bay.
yeah I reckon that space for aux battery is so handy for a few things. Airbox, catch can, fuel separator... even a compressor. Especially on later models with ABS and rear aircon where the bay is tighter still.Thats a tight engine bay, but it looks the goods! No second battery under my bonnet, so i've got room to play with. if i need to jump start the 'trol I've got one of those lithium jump packs. I'll run some lithium Batteries in the rear with a DC-DC charger.
I'm setting my rig up as a tourer, so i'm not looking at going ridiculous with anything, and need to find room for a fuel-water separator somewhere under the bonnet and i think a custom bracket where the second battery would go is a good candidate.
I squarely fall into that "later model" category, The ABS and rear aircon have made a mess of the engine bay, so I'm all kinds of keen to use that big block of spare space for something OTHER than a second battery. Ideally i'd like to remove the rear aircon unit to get rid of the weight and excess piping under the hood if i can.yeah I reckon that space for aux battery is so handy for a few things. Airbox, catch can, fuel separator... even a compressor. Especially on later models with ABS and rear aircon where the bay is tighter still.
I see what you're saying, but from what I understand, having a needle setup at 10psi at 100kmh (roughly 2450rpm for me) would just mean that the needle is not allowing full boost until after that RPM is met, which would mean a loss of low down boostNice review on your setup, there's nothing like a good long run to find this stuff out. It's a shame about your needle valve setup not being amazing. however to counter your findings and conclusion, i would say that your needle valve wasn't setup correctly. I've got one here ready to install once i get around to replacing my intercooler so I've been doing a lot of reading on how to set it up and from what i can find, you should be balancing the dawes and needle for about 10-psi at highway speeds.
That maybe why your fuel usage was so high > more air = more fuel in order to maintain the proper combustion AFR.
hmmm... I'm still wrapping my head around how it all works, but my understanding is that the needle is allowing some vacuum leak at all time and allowing the feedback from the boost line to determine the boost curve. by taking the vac solenoid and ECU out of the equation the boost curve is alot more predictable. Again, I haven't done the install yet, so i haven't had the joy of balancing and playing with it, but from what i read, it is a balancing act between the two to get the perfect amount of highway speed boost, and low down torque and responsiveness. Anecdotally, I see people only opening the needle 1/8th, or less, of a turn.I see what you're saying, but from what I understand, having a needle setup at 10psi at 100kmh (roughly 2450rpm for me) would just mean that the needle is not allowing full boost until after that RPM is met, which would mean a loss of low down boost
Yep the in cabin needle is for exactly that. Boost early when you’re around town, but dial it back on highway to drop the cruising Boost. Definitely something I couldn’t be bothered with managing, and there’s better options out there now.hmmm... I'm still wrapping my head around how it all works, but my understanding is that the needle is allowing some vacuum leak at all time and allowing the feedback from the boost line to determine the boost curve. by taking the vac solenoid and ECU out of the equation the boost curve is alot more predictable. Again, I haven't done the install yet, so i haven't had the joy of balancing and playing with it, but from what i read, it is a balancing act between the two to get the perfect amount of highway speed boost, and low down torque and responsiveness. Anecdotally, I see people only opening the needle 1/8th, or less, of a turn.
now that i think of it, that might be why a lot of people seem to run the needle valve in the cabin - can adjust this balance on the fly depending on the task at hand.
personally i don't want to see full boost at highway speeds, that leaves me no headroom to put my boot into it to pass a truck on an uphill stretch - plus the whole burning more fuel thing.
EDIT: @jackbyo out of interest, what method did you use to setup the Dawes and Needle valve?
Seems it worked out for you too.Last week I did a 2000km trip from Sydney to the north coast via a few spots. Great camping, scenery and weather.
The patrol went very well, but I became sick to ****ing death of it's highway behaviour. The tillix+needle post remap has been great for down low torque, but highways are just a bit of a screaming nightmare at 21psi the whole time. My fuel usage was 13-14lph which I think could be better too.
Today I did a flat highway run with 80-100km/h speed limits, then got rid of the tillix and returned to the factory vac solenoid for the drive home on the same highway. The tillix is capped at 21.5psi, and I was using cruise control.
Here's some results.
Tillix + Needle
Tillix + Vacsol
- 80kmh, fourth gear, ~18.5psi
- 90kmh, fifth gear, ~19psi
- 100kmh, fifth gear, ~21psi
In terms of around town, initially I thought I had lost my low down torque, but I was wrong. Once I tested it, I realised I was still hitting 20+psi at about 1900rpm (same as before). In fact, the apparent difference in torque seems to be that between gear changes and with foot off the accelerator, the RPM is dropping off nice and quickly now with the vacsol.
- 80kmh, fourth gear, ~8.5psi
- 90kmh, fifth gear, ~11.5psi
- 100kmh, fifth gear, ~ 13.5psi
Seems that when I had the needle valve, the RPMs would "hold" higher between gear changes or coming off the accelerator.
My driving style compensated really quickly, and in fact I was finding my gear changes felt a lot smoother because of this. The power is still there when I want it.
I didn't notice any rise in EGT, but having said that my gauge is the combo redarc one which starts at 300 and moves in increments of about 20, so I'm not getting the finer details there.
I also didn't have a chance to try any big uphills at highway speeds, but on some smaller hills around here I would still hit 21psi boost when I kicked the boot in. I think the EGTs will be same as before on long hills, as the boost will be there when under load. Will test this out soon.
Initial fuel economy suggest a significant improvement, although I really need a bigger run to confirm this.
I will say, the final 30min leg of my trip (with scangauge fuel usage reset) which is predominantly 80kmh and about 5 mins of 50-60kmh city, gave me a average fuel economy of 9.4lph. I certainly haven't seen under 10lph since before the remap/tillix.
The noise is seriously improved. That big bloody stainless snorkel (even with the ram head), and all aluminium airbox/pipework seems to generate a lot of induction noise. At highway speeds at 21psi, it's really audible. Sitting at 13ish, it's hardly noticeable.
I'm really happy with the combination of remap + tillix + vacsol
Photos below (obviously taken by my passenger) indicate numbers. Ignore the "AVG" for average fuel consumption on these pics, but "LPH" is the instant fuel usage.
EGT is a separate gauge but remained under the 300 mark for both
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And in case anyone needed a reminder of how to set it up
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I'm not sure what you mean by that. As far as I know, the max boost is controlled only by the tillix/dawes. ECPT set the tillix at 22 when they did the first remap.EDIT: what's your max boost set at in your ECU remap?
Ah fair enough Trev. I agree your vacsol is probably fine if it’s a 2016, so perhaps there’s other variables at play here. We know those Nissan engineers have made many little changes throughout the years that we aren’t fully aware of. Then again, there seems to be discrepancies between exact same year models so who knows. So hard to know what’s going on with the ECU related stuff.@J0SHMAN
Until you've actually tried out the combinations @jackbyo listed above, you will not know how your vehicle responds. They're all a bit different. That's why good tuners don't just load a stock tune into your vehicle's ECU and send you on your way. They all respond differently. The high boost scenario Jack mentions with tillix and needle is very common. If you adjust your needle open to lower the boost at cruise you loose low down driveability. That's why we used to run a dual dawes/tillix, so we could switch between the two, some even automated that process pending throttle position and egt's.
I'm probably the bloke referred to above who hasn't had success with using the vacsol after remap. My vehicle is a 2016. It's highly unlikely the vacsol is buggered. Unfortunately I'm not the only one who hasn't had success with this (just call any reputable tuner and ask how many patrols they tune without manual boost control?). We just don't rain on anyone's parade that has had success with it.
I've got my own theories why mine didn't work. Slowly working through them as I constantly learn more about how the system works (I've owned a zd30 patrol for 14 years, only been working on this one for 4) and I certainly don't claim to know everything. There is lots of new (and old) info in the threads Jack highlighted above that keep you thinking. If it was just plain and easy to set up the perfect system, these conversations wouldn't even exist.
Be sure to share your findings with everyone as you trial each system.
Thanks for the honest write up @jackbyo 👍