Deffinitly following. Im getting ready to pull engine and box for a full driveway rebuild in the next month or two. An adventure that began with a power steer belt 😂

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my 10c, the hella cheap option isnt a good one and prolly not one to consider as i'd guess that it may have hurt a liner (it may not have and if it hasnt then it could work), machining costs will be the biggest killler doing it yourself and a reco 2.8 will prolly end up just being cheaper.

i'd consider sitting on it and waiting for a cheap wrecked donor car to come along with a 3L or 4.2 at an auction and piss the 2.8 off

 

G'day Tim,

Can you explain your catch can plumbing? I may have read it incorrectly, but does your current plumbing go from rocker cover>hose>catch can inlet>catch can outlet>hose>turbocharger drain? Or have you connected the fluid drain line on the bottom of the Provent to your turbocharger drain line?

If the catch can return in plumbed back into the turbocharger return, there is no crankcase ventilation now. The crankcase breather line must be vented to a low pressure environment with the factory location being before the compressor wheel. The turbocharger drain line is connected back into the crankcase. No pressure will be relieved in this configuration.

It is entirely possible if your plumbing is configured as above that your crankcase pressure built to such a level that oil has been forced through seals into the intake tract. A diesel engine will run on its own lubricating oil and cause runaway like you experienced. Your description of sudden and repeated reduction in manifold pressure without change in throttle position can be an indicator of liquid oil being ingested by the turbocharger. As the liquid is ingested the compressor will lose efficiency and the pressure ratio and net flow will reduce, and once the liquid has been cleared from the compressor PR and net flow return to expected. This will appear to you as boost 'bouncing,' dropping and returning to target.

All RD28's do not have liners. You can bore and hone or overbore and fit a liner, but this will not be cost effective.

The description of number six piston sounds like foreign body damage. Could you please put up a photo of the damage to the valve and piston?

Best of luck Tim.

Cheers,
Mick

 

So like Mick said the rd28 doesn't have liners, and I've got a price of 200 bux or so for a machine of the cylinders from a guy near me, and another hundred to machine the face of the block, so that shouldn't be the biggest cost, the kit is the biggest cost, and the head reco.
As for the catch can plumbing Mick, I probably didn't explain it too well. Rocker cover - hose - catch can inlet - catch can outlet - hose - nipple on intake piping. It was connected in the correct manner, it was just that instead of empting a bottle or hose every now and then I decided to plumb it into the turbo drain line and save myself some time. But... As someone explained to me in another thread this would have put the turbo drain line under vacuum cos it would get vacuumed from the intake piping sucking the oil out of the turbo drain. So I'm now thinking that when I was giving it heaps, perhaps the oil was sucking up the cc drain line from the turbo, then when I reapplied my foot, some oil dropped back, or the massive negative pressure was pulling oil of of the sump or pulling it through the turbo oil galley and flooded the turbo....? The runaway was definitely a combination of a few things I rekon... Gotta be pretty unlucky for that to happen...?

Photos should be at the end of the original post. Can't get better one of the valve cos it's still in the head.. And the piston photo doesn't come out to well cos too much black for the detail to show up..

 

The valve looks something like that from the bank, but not as bad. Crack starts at outside edge about 4mm wide and ends halfway to centre of valve.
Other photos may be different angles etc. Can try N get more of anyone wants.

 

More photos

Hopefully some good angles. Looks like all pistons are ok except for 6. So I could get away with only one new piston and hone and rings... But can't hone the face without taking motor out..

 

Number 6 looks like it's melted the piston by the look of the section where the precombustion chamber is

If your going to do a rebuild I'd be doing it properly or you'll be stripping it again to Fix something else. I'd also be looking to replace the head. With the heat that seems to have been at number 6 I'd be surprised if the head isn't cracked.

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Haven't had the head cleaned and checked yet, didn't show a crack last time until we had it cleaned up, so may be the same... If that's the case I may go 4 new engine option...? More dollars though...
And yeah I would prefer to reco whole block, but trying to save $$$, would be easier to do only one piston. But I understand your point. Poor man pays twice...

 

It is a well documented fact on here that unless the cooling system is in really top nick, number 6 piston cops it when overheating. There is a mod to help overcome this...so do a search on here RD28 head mod or the like.
And as for just doing one pot ....my old man did this to a Massey Ferguson 65 tractor half a century ago. And that's all he did...didn't even replace bearings...and that was at approx. 5000 hours. When I last saw the tractor about 10 years ago ...the hour meter stopped in the second time around at 1950 hrs...so that made 11950 hours...and the then owner hadn't touched it. Dad sold it at 9000 hours. So it can be done ...providing everything is in good nick.

Cheers Keith

 

Did a search on head mod, didn't find anything. This isn't the factory head though. It overheated a few years back N we installed a head from Harris engines here in Perth. Was going fine until it ran away. As far as I remember the head had extra cooling channels that the stock didn't. Is this what you mean by mod? Or is there an external one I don't know about?

I don't know if the melted injector port is related to the damaged piston or the piston damage is a result of the runaway, and the injector is stuffed anyway...?

 

There is an external one ...a fitting that is machined into the welsh plug at the back of the head....

http://www.patrol4x4.com/forum/niss...y60-ford-maverick-11/2-8-cylinder-head-mods-173922/?highlight=2.8+cylinder+head

Apparently the heater hose that goes from the head is diverted onto this setup ...and a plug put where heater hose was.

Cheers Keith

 

Looks ok. Don't know how he went though, no input since April 2014 I think it was... If it's an easily available and doable mod I'll do it... I didn't know they got that hot back there though...

 

Looks ok. Don't know how he went though, no input since April 2014 I think it was... If it's an easily available and doable mod I'll do it... I didn't know they got that hot back there though...

Its right next to number 6..the problem one!!
My head reconditioner bloke here reckons its a good mod to do...as it can mean quite a temp drop around no6 ...which for some reason has really small water passages from factory.

Cheers Keith

 

I know others have done it but I agree that even if you had the money for a 4.2 that would be a bad option. It would be cheaper to fix the 2.8, sell it and buy a GU TD42T. They are a worthwhile conversion for a 3.0 because they have a suitable gearbox and diffs but the 2.8 does not.

I would look for a second hand engine and just use that without touching it as long as compression was OK. When I've been wandering around the Patrols in wrecking yards I've seen a couple of 2.8s left in the wrecks while the 3.0s and 4.2s get pulled out and stored in the shed. This leads me to expect that demand is low and the price might reflect this.

If you can't get a replacement engine at a decent price then I'd pull the engine and do a rebuild. I've not rebuilt a 2.8 but can't see they would be any harder than any other diesel. I'd get the head reconditioned and do the rest myself. Go with your own judgement on the bottom end when you pull it apart. If the crank basically looks OK then plastigauge everything to make sure.

The reason for the run away is another issue and needs to be sorted out before everything gets put back together.

Cheers,

 

G'day Tim,

I agree with Inbits, the number six piston looks deformed from melting. The number six precombustion chamber too looks to be deformed. This photo is from a GQ head though the precombustion chamber shares the same part number.



Looking at your photos and the information about the catch can I would think that yes, you did pull aerated and frothy oil up from the turbocharger drain and into the intake tract causing your runaway. But I also think your number six injector jammed open and has damaged the precombustion chamber and piston as well as burning the number six exhaust valve. The white deposit on the valve is an indicator of very high combustion chamber temperature.

If the bore appears to be undamaged in number six you may be able to change the piston and have the head reconditioned. You may also be able to pull the number six connecting rod and piston from below with the sump off and if so you may be able to hone it. The RD28 is fairly easy to take out of the car though and I imagine it would be less effort than changing a piston in the car. I would think the valve seat for number six exhaust will be damaged as well. I payed $2090 for a full head recondition which included new precombustion chambers, valve seats 'n' stem seals, lifters and all machine work from Wearings Diesel in Townsville. It was done very well.

The coolant modification is to drill and tap into the lower, larger welch plug and attach a large diameter hose to take coolant out from the back of the head and forward after the engine coolant outlet. I made a different modification where I used the heater outlet on the head as an extra coolant inlet. This appeared to work well.

Can I suggest that you do not plumb the catch can back into the motor? The risk of runaway is increased but also the oil and condensed water mix that forms in the catch can is often some truly gunky stuff. I wouldn't want to add anything from the puke tank back into my sump.

Good luck man, I have an RD28T head that is damaged, a spare block + rotating assembly and a whole engine on a stand if you need any photos.

Cheers,
Mick

 

One extra thing Tim, do you still have the factory crankcase breather non-return valve fitted? It is a large disc shaped valve that the breather line from the turbocharger inlet connects to. I think for the GU it is on top of the rocker cover near the vacuum pump?

If so I'm willing to bet on your return to the turbocharger drain being the culprit. That valve is there to prevent the turbocharger from placing the crankcase under negative pressure. In the presence of light vacuum the valve will close. If that valve is closed then the suction from the turbocharger inlet will put the puke tank under negative pressure. If the line to the turbocharger oil drain did not have a valve or the valve was open then it too will be under suction and pick up frothy oil from the return line.

Poo, this sucks mate.

Cheers,
Mick

 

6 pot looks undamaged to the eye, and to my fingernail, won't know till i go over it and measure it etc. And yes the little black disk is still there, I've always wondered what that was for.
I think my Plan of attack will be get the head cleaned and inspected etc, and if it's not too stuffed then reco it, and then do the block. Honed, bored, and crank balance(???). And refit.
If the head is stuffed or the block is stuffed I rekon it will be a case of save more money N buy doner 4.2. I like the 4.2 idea a lot, but don't know how many hidden costs I will come across. Plus you have the outlay of the doner and the space to store it.
Anyone put a 3l in the 28 body? I know it's probably not worth it, but if it bolts straight in.??

 

The 3.0 won't bolt straight in. It has the same drive train as the 4.2. If you are going to the trouble of making the required drive train changes then the 4.2 is the way to go.

 

Unfortunately Tim the ZD30 will not bolt straight in. The RB30 will, as the RD28T and RB30 almost share the same block though do share the same transmission and engine mounts. Probably not what you are after.

You may not need a crankshaft rebalance. If you go with an OEM piston I'd feel comfortable to leave the rest of the rotating assembly. Just don't go hanging off the governor for minutes at a time. If a new connecting rod is required then I would most definitely balance the rotating assembly regardless of OEM or not.

Best case scenario for you Tim will be a new piston, new rings, new precombustion chamber in number six and a skim of the head with a new head gasket and head bolts. With the short(ish) time you've had this head on the block I'd like to think you may not need to have the block decked but if you are pulling the engine it would be good to have it done.

Cheers,
Mick

 

If by hanging off the governor u mean holding it pinned, I never really did that voluntarily... Occasional climb means u have to hold it pinned, but I don't go flat out for ages...
So I'm pretty happy I won't be doing that.
The reco kit looks legit and the company that uses them up north seem to rate them..
Im still tossing up between all 6 cylinders and just the one... I rekon all is the go. Don't wanna regret it...
Can I expect any more power or driveability from the finished product? Or am I dreaming?
Cheers for the answers.
Tim

 

More power? Yeah, you're dreaming. An RD28 is what it is. Unless there was something particularly wrong with it before the runaway, it will feel pretty much the same after the rebuild. The easiest swap for more power is an RB30 turbo engine like they had in the VL Commodores. It will drink fuel like an 4.8 but it will go like one as well.

The 2.8 will normally be fine if held flat for long periods. Everyone that owns one does that, same as the TD42 N/A owners.

 

Hahaha, I thought it was wishful thinking.. I've milked all the power I can out of the poor little thing.. Unichip, zorst, blocked all the unnecessary shet, and 4in snorkel. Can't ask for much more really.. Cept heart transplant..
So I think I'm rebuilding it.
Has anyone done this job at home? Without any previous experience of a rebuild. I got head of ok, changed turbo previously without major issues? Too big job for home? Opinions?

 

Too big job for home? Opinions?

Not too big at all. The biggest problem for most people is actually getting the old engine out and the rebuilt one in. Most domestic garages aren't high enough to use a chain block so the best solution is an engine crane with the car on the driveway if there isn't enough height in the garage. These could be obtained from your normal equipment hire outfit for reasonable money but you can now buy them from Supercheap etc for under $300 and an engine stand for half that. Ask around, you may already have a mate with this gear.

If you can pull a head off and change a turbo without stuffing anything you will have no trouble following a manual to bolt an engine together.

Cheers,

 

Well overboard, car doesn't fit in garage at all, so will be a remove in driveway, that's no issue, bonnets already off, just need to find lift and stand, shouldn't be too hard... And the money.. That will be more difficult... Thanks 4 the advice, pretty much what I wanted to hear.

 

Just regarding your query of replacing 1 piston, or all six, ring a few suppliers, because a few I've dealt with in the past will charge each piston out individually, but you can only buy them in sets.

 

Yeah, made a few calls, they aren't readily available, so ebay is the go I rekon...

 

So, for whoever is interested, gonna do a 4.2 conversion when I have saved enough money, looking like august some time. But in the mean time, I'm going to replace one piston and get just the one valve done (and seat), just to get me back on the road again... N if it runs a bit rough, who give a f$"k, so the engine is gonna come out anyway. N if it runs sweet, well good, I'll drive it for a bit N sell it complete later.
Thanks for all the replies!

 

Sounds good,
Look forward to the conversion thread